Jim
The topic you brought up has been debated many times on the forum. I am firmly in the "yes there is a lost mine (or two or three) camp". As to whether or not church (or other types) treasure has been secreted in the Superstitions..who can say..but nothing would surprise me.
If you went through the old posts I believe you would find an often lively answer to the question you asked.
Peter
PS
Had an intersting time in the mountains this past Saturday night. First time I saw a lightning storm like that up close and personal. Cool the way the full moon was shining on one part of the range and thunderclouds blasted another.....spooky....
The Stone Maps
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Joe Ribaudo
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Signs
Jim,
For me, it is a rather simple answer. My Uncle Chuck saw gold ingots marked with five dots connected by lines making a crown. That denotes the "Kings Royal Fifth" and makes a pretty good arguement for a Spanish presence in the Superstitions. There is one man alive today, that I know of, who also saw the ingots and participated in the search to retrace Harry
LaFrance's path to the cave of gold bars. That would be, of course, Tracy Hawkins.
The markings on Black Top Mesa and the direction of the stones in the cactus marker are further evidence of a specific time, matching the stories, and once again the presence of the Spanish.
The stories of the Peralta decendents, the Apache Indians and the persistent legends point to lost (covered) mines and possible treasure.
There is a great deal more that I can say on this subject, but I will wait and see what the others have to give you.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribauudo
For me, it is a rather simple answer. My Uncle Chuck saw gold ingots marked with five dots connected by lines making a crown. That denotes the "Kings Royal Fifth" and makes a pretty good arguement for a Spanish presence in the Superstitions. There is one man alive today, that I know of, who also saw the ingots and participated in the search to retrace Harry
LaFrance's path to the cave of gold bars. That would be, of course, Tracy Hawkins.
The markings on Black Top Mesa and the direction of the stones in the cactus marker are further evidence of a specific time, matching the stories, and once again the presence of the Spanish.
The stories of the Peralta decendents, the Apache Indians and the persistent legends point to lost (covered) mines and possible treasure.
There is a great deal more that I can say on this subject, but I will wait and see what the others have to give you.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribauudo
Last edited by Joe Ribaudo on Tue Aug 03, 2004 3:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Wyatt Westwood
- Part Timer
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- Location: New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Australia
Jim Hamrick Wrote:
I do appreciate all of you who took time to answer my post. I am amazed at the number of hits this site gets. It seems that there are many people who think there is lost treasure or a lost mine in the superstitions.
Wyatt Westwood Answers:
Your Welcome Mr Hamrick. It's true there is a lot of people who believe in the Legend of the Lost Dutchman. I for one believe in it for one reason only. That reason shakes the very foundation of known history of the Spanish Mining Techniques in Arizona. All of the Mountain Ranges in Arizona have been systematically surveyed and prospected by thousands of slaves just as they did all over the world in the search for Gold.
Jim Hamrick Wrote:
Not knowing all of the history I would like to pose a question, why do so many of you believe there is a secreted treasure or a lost mine in the Superstitions? If any treasure is stashed in the mountain it would or will be the paintings that DeGrazia supposedly burnt.
Wyatt Westwood Writes:
I believe that if they prospected all areas of the Mountain Ranges and low lands they could certainly hide the Mother Load Gold Mines in a way no other Geologists, Archaeologists or Mining Engineers / Prospectors could find the Mine Entrances hidden for the King.
Jim Hamrick Wrote:
If one believes that what Sims Ely researched and wrote a book about is based on true facts then there could be a mine. If there is a mine that the Peraltas worked for three generations there should be physical evidence of the mine(it was suppose to be a typical Spanish mine of that era in that it was cone shaped) and a large camp area along with corrals for the animals. According to Mr Ely he and Jim Bark searched four decades for it. Mr Ely claimed that there was a trail three foot wide worn in to the rocks from the hoofs of many animals visible but they could never find a mine. If there was a mine could it perhaps be Gold Field where early accounts said that it was an old mine and had rich surface ore.
Wyatt Westwood Writes:
Jim, if the Mine is Near Gold Field and first water it is very well hidden.
This was also a typical of the Spanish Mines for the time. Some of them were hidden under boulders and sealed with logs and caliche and these were shafts straight down prior to the 1700s. Later generations used the old shafts for access and hid them again when done. The Signs and Symbols of the area support your theory. If there is a Spanish Mine at First Water near Gold Field they would have had a couple of hundred years to hide the entrance and surrounding placers or low grade gold pocket Mines. They were masters of Mining and knew how to do this to every Mother Load Mine owned by the King of Spain and the Vatican. The Trails you speak of are of typical design through out the history of the Spanish Mining and Gold Laden Treasure Highways constructed for the transport of the smelted Gold and Silver Bars Stamped.
According to History the Peraltas were attacked carrying only the Gold Ore before they had time to take it to the Smelters and process it. They had time to hide the Mine Entrance before the attack and ensuing slaughter. This indicates to me that maybe the Gold Mine entrance is not as hard to open as one might think. All of the Smelters of Spanish design I have seen in the field are fairly close and always up high taking advantage of the winds on mountain tops for the Smelters to gain enough forced air to reach the proper temperature. From the accounts of their attack it says they were heading for higher ground with the raw ore when the attack happened. These large Camp Areas for the Mule Pack Trains I have seen in many other Spanish Mining districts along with the rock corrals.
Thanks,
Very Good Point Jim!
I do appreciate all of you who took time to answer my post. I am amazed at the number of hits this site gets. It seems that there are many people who think there is lost treasure or a lost mine in the superstitions.
Wyatt Westwood Answers:
Your Welcome Mr Hamrick. It's true there is a lot of people who believe in the Legend of the Lost Dutchman. I for one believe in it for one reason only. That reason shakes the very foundation of known history of the Spanish Mining Techniques in Arizona. All of the Mountain Ranges in Arizona have been systematically surveyed and prospected by thousands of slaves just as they did all over the world in the search for Gold.
Jim Hamrick Wrote:
Not knowing all of the history I would like to pose a question, why do so many of you believe there is a secreted treasure or a lost mine in the Superstitions? If any treasure is stashed in the mountain it would or will be the paintings that DeGrazia supposedly burnt.
Wyatt Westwood Writes:
I believe that if they prospected all areas of the Mountain Ranges and low lands they could certainly hide the Mother Load Gold Mines in a way no other Geologists, Archaeologists or Mining Engineers / Prospectors could find the Mine Entrances hidden for the King.
Jim Hamrick Wrote:
If one believes that what Sims Ely researched and wrote a book about is based on true facts then there could be a mine. If there is a mine that the Peraltas worked for three generations there should be physical evidence of the mine(it was suppose to be a typical Spanish mine of that era in that it was cone shaped) and a large camp area along with corrals for the animals. According to Mr Ely he and Jim Bark searched four decades for it. Mr Ely claimed that there was a trail three foot wide worn in to the rocks from the hoofs of many animals visible but they could never find a mine. If there was a mine could it perhaps be Gold Field where early accounts said that it was an old mine and had rich surface ore.
Wyatt Westwood Writes:
Jim, if the Mine is Near Gold Field and first water it is very well hidden.
This was also a typical of the Spanish Mines for the time. Some of them were hidden under boulders and sealed with logs and caliche and these were shafts straight down prior to the 1700s. Later generations used the old shafts for access and hid them again when done. The Signs and Symbols of the area support your theory. If there is a Spanish Mine at First Water near Gold Field they would have had a couple of hundred years to hide the entrance and surrounding placers or low grade gold pocket Mines. They were masters of Mining and knew how to do this to every Mother Load Mine owned by the King of Spain and the Vatican. The Trails you speak of are of typical design through out the history of the Spanish Mining and Gold Laden Treasure Highways constructed for the transport of the smelted Gold and Silver Bars Stamped.
According to History the Peraltas were attacked carrying only the Gold Ore before they had time to take it to the Smelters and process it. They had time to hide the Mine Entrance before the attack and ensuing slaughter. This indicates to me that maybe the Gold Mine entrance is not as hard to open as one might think. All of the Smelters of Spanish design I have seen in the field are fairly close and always up high taking advantage of the winds on mountain tops for the Smelters to gain enough forced air to reach the proper temperature. From the accounts of their attack it says they were heading for higher ground with the raw ore when the attack happened. These large Camp Areas for the Mule Pack Trains I have seen in many other Spanish Mining districts along with the rock corrals.
Thanks,
Very Good Point Jim!
kings royal fifth
there was a small group of men in the late 1960's that found a treasure close to first water road....i knew one of them personally....from what he told me it was the" royal fifth"...the kings share of the gold the spaniards had found in the area
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Joe Ribaudo
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The Royal Fifth
Dave,
The Spaniards in the New World went to great lengths to cheat the King Of Spain out of his "Royal fifth". It seems unlikely that they set aside anything mined in this area for the king.
If any "Royal Fifth" treasure is found in the area of the Superstition Mountains, it is more likely that it was brought there from the south, with the express purpose of hiding it from Spanish officials, and thus, the King Of Spain.
Your story is interesting, to say the least. Are there any details you can add without giving away too much?
Respectfully,
Joe
The Spaniards in the New World went to great lengths to cheat the King Of Spain out of his "Royal fifth". It seems unlikely that they set aside anything mined in this area for the king.
If any "Royal Fifth" treasure is found in the area of the Superstition Mountains, it is more likely that it was brought there from the south, with the express purpose of hiding it from Spanish officials, and thus, the King Of Spain.
Your story is interesting, to say the least. Are there any details you can add without giving away too much?
Respectfully,
Joe
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Joe Ribaudo
- Expert
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Wide Trail
Jim,
"Mr Ely claimed that ther was a trail three foot wide worn in to the rocks from the hoofs of many animals visable but they could never find a mine."
I can't recall seeing this statement in Ely's book. That doesn't mean it's not there, just may be my poor memory. Did he make the statement in some other place?
Respectfully,
Joe
"Mr Ely claimed that ther was a trail three foot wide worn in to the rocks from the hoofs of many animals visable but they could never find a mine."
I can't recall seeing this statement in Ely's book. That doesn't mean it's not there, just may be my poor memory. Did he make the statement in some other place?
Respectfully,
Joe
royal fifth
sure joe....email me and i'll tell you what i know about it [email protected]
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JIM HAMRICK
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- Contact:
The Stone Maps
Mr Ribaudo
The discription of a worn pathway came from a presentation by Northcutt Ely to the Fortnightly Club in Redlands California on March 3, 1988. In this presentation Mr. Ely also said that he had been allowed to make a photostatic copy of Mr. Ruths blood stained notebook and this he had sent to his father.
All of the above information I obtained from the "net" and am assuming that it is factual. I have never read Sims Ely's book. It looks like I need to read Lost Dutchman books so that I don't appear too dumb when posting to this site as many of you are apparently very knowledgeable on this subject.
The discription of a worn pathway came from a presentation by Northcutt Ely to the Fortnightly Club in Redlands California on March 3, 1988. In this presentation Mr. Ely also said that he had been allowed to make a photostatic copy of Mr. Ruths blood stained notebook and this he had sent to his father.
All of the above information I obtained from the "net" and am assuming that it is factual. I have never read Sims Ely's book. It looks like I need to read Lost Dutchman books so that I don't appear too dumb when posting to this site as many of you are apparently very knowledgeable on this subject.
Hi Jim,
If I recall correctly, Ely was describing the trail that Jimmy Anderson had found going up Bluff Spring Mountain. Personally, I don't recall much of that trail that would fit that description. Ely also places the trail on the east side of the mountain, whereas the currently well-known trail that is attributed to Anderson is more on the south end.
You could read all the LDM books in existance and still not know very much real stuff about the subject. Just look at all of us! I've read more books, manuscripts, etc on the subject than I can count, and I don't know s**t! (Just ask Joe!)
PS: If you want to save some time, though, go right to Tom Glover's book. Jack Carlson's "Hiker's Guide" has a lot of good stuff too.
If I recall correctly, Ely was describing the trail that Jimmy Anderson had found going up Bluff Spring Mountain. Personally, I don't recall much of that trail that would fit that description. Ely also places the trail on the east side of the mountain, whereas the currently well-known trail that is attributed to Anderson is more on the south end.
You could read all the LDM books in existance and still not know very much real stuff about the subject. Just look at all of us! I've read more books, manuscripts, etc on the subject than I can count, and I don't know s**t! (Just ask Joe!)
PS: If you want to save some time, though, go right to Tom Glover's book. Jack Carlson's "Hiker's Guide" has a lot of good stuff too.
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Wyatt Westwood
- Part Timer
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- Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:49 pm
- Location: New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Australia
The Zig Zag Peon Trails were very worn trails and sometimes they crossed paths with the Royal and Walker Trails from what I have seen personally in the field. The construction of the roads that I have found are about three foot wide with rock bridges and walls or (Bars) at points. The roads move in and out of the topography along the Mining trails disappearing into the side of a mountain like ghostly highways to the dark underworld of death trapped mines.
I have never read Mr Ely's book either. I am sure I will buy a copy soon.
Nothcutt Ely, now that's a name!
I wouldn't worry to much Mr Hamrick there are a few including myself that have only read what's necessary in order to keep an open mind while searching for the LDM or Peralta Stone Maps. Field Research can find or see what's actually there at the sites that match any known information gathered from reliable or not so reliable archival document research. Break through in this science come to those that take a chance and come to their own conclusions based on the solid facts found at the Final Gold Mine Sites. This requires reversing everything found at the sites by GPS Survey, Compass Bearings and a physical mapping of the site. Getting to the final gold mine site is a different story. It can only get better with practice. It helps if you have a pictorial symbols and sign book of the thousands of rock monuments in your head to draw upon.
Some new photos of the site I worked this last weekend are astounding. The photo is of two Spanish Drill Holes showing the two mines ahead. It came from a Final Gold Mine Site with ruins of and old Spanish Mission Rock "Vista" which I also have a photo of to be added on to my photo Gallery Site.
Wyatt Westwood
I have never read Mr Ely's book either. I am sure I will buy a copy soon.
Nothcutt Ely, now that's a name!
I wouldn't worry to much Mr Hamrick there are a few including myself that have only read what's necessary in order to keep an open mind while searching for the LDM or Peralta Stone Maps. Field Research can find or see what's actually there at the sites that match any known information gathered from reliable or not so reliable archival document research. Break through in this science come to those that take a chance and come to their own conclusions based on the solid facts found at the Final Gold Mine Sites. This requires reversing everything found at the sites by GPS Survey, Compass Bearings and a physical mapping of the site. Getting to the final gold mine site is a different story. It can only get better with practice. It helps if you have a pictorial symbols and sign book of the thousands of rock monuments in your head to draw upon.
Some new photos of the site I worked this last weekend are astounding. The photo is of two Spanish Drill Holes showing the two mines ahead. It came from a Final Gold Mine Site with ruins of and old Spanish Mission Rock "Vista" which I also have a photo of to be added on to my photo Gallery Site.
Wyatt Westwood
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Joe Ribaudo
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Good Question!
Wiz,
"Is your mind more open the less you read?"
There are always some really good questions that come along here. Your's has got to be one of the best.
I do not agree with your assessment of my assessment of you.
On the other hand, it does seem to fall into your own opinion of yourself and your knowledge, as stated more than once on this forum.
Respectfully,
Joe
"Is your mind more open the less you read?"
There are always some really good questions that come along here. Your's has got to be one of the best.
I do not agree with your assessment of my assessment of you.
On the other hand, it does seem to fall into your own opinion of yourself and your knowledge, as stated more than once on this forum.
Respectfully,
Joe
Re: Good Question!
Yeah? Well, I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of my assessment of your assessment of me.Joe Ribaudo wrote:I do not agree with your assessment of my assessment of you.
Speaking of assessments...has anyone noticed that the "Stone Map" thread has 7000 seven hundred and something views, therefore making it
the most viewed thread on the forum?
Well its pool time for me...Nah maybe the hot tub...nah maybe the pool...
AZ living sure puts my decision making into a conundrum...... poor poor pitiful me.....
the most viewed thread on the forum?
Well its pool time for me...Nah maybe the hot tub...nah maybe the pool...
AZ living sure puts my decision making into a conundrum...... poor poor pitiful me.....
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Joe Ribaudo
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homesick?
So Peter,
Would you rather be back east?
What is even more impressive, would be the total views on all of the topics thhat deal with the Stone Maps, and the little side bars that follow into other topics.
Seems to be a little interest in those fakes.
Respectfully,
Joe
Would you rather be back east?
What is even more impressive, would be the total views on all of the topics thhat deal with the Stone Maps, and the little side bars that follow into other topics.
Seems to be a little interest in those fakes.
Respectfully,
Joe
stone maps
WIZ; It,s been my assessment that the more we know, the more we realize just how ignorant we really are??? Sometimes tho we try to take in too much info and clutter our minds up so much it,s really hard to think clearly on a topic or subject... 
Bill Pete; Your in the west now you can relax and let it all hang out.. Bill
Bill Pete; Your in the west now you can relax and let it all hang out.. BillJoe,
Actually I was poking fun at the Stone Maps, attempting to show that no matter how many views on the forum it doesnt make them any more relevant to the LDM than they already are (which as you well know...is not at all).
Bill
Yes my wife is always scolding me about my attire (or lack thereof)during my night swimming forays. I do indeed let it all hang out on occassion.
Wiz
But then I would not only have to decide on pool or spa, but also choose between so many different adult beverages. Beer? Pina Colada? Margarita? Decisions decisions......
Actually I was poking fun at the Stone Maps, attempting to show that no matter how many views on the forum it doesnt make them any more relevant to the LDM than they already are (which as you well know...is not at all).
Bill
Yes my wife is always scolding me about my attire (or lack thereof)during my night swimming forays. I do indeed let it all hang out on occassion.
Wiz
But then I would not only have to decide on pool or spa, but also choose between so many different adult beverages. Beer? Pina Colada? Margarita? Decisions decisions......
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Joe Ribaudo
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How Do He Know?
Peter,
"Actually I was poking fun at the Stone Maps, attempting to show that no matter how many views on the forum it doesnt make them any more relevant to the LDM than they already are (which as you well know...is not at all)."
How could anyone possibly "know", since no one that I know of, is working Waltz's mine?
Like the archaeologist who will seldom make a "positive" statement concerning his conclusions, there is always the chance that your own conclusions can be changed overnight by someone falling in a hole.
It is good to see that you have already figured out that night time is the best for using a pool here in Arizona. Skin cancer is a pain in the.....derma. I have managed to avoid it, so far, but I work at not getting it.
Respectfully,
Joe
"Actually I was poking fun at the Stone Maps, attempting to show that no matter how many views on the forum it doesnt make them any more relevant to the LDM than they already are (which as you well know...is not at all)."
How could anyone possibly "know", since no one that I know of, is working Waltz's mine?
Like the archaeologist who will seldom make a "positive" statement concerning his conclusions, there is always the chance that your own conclusions can be changed overnight by someone falling in a hole.
It is good to see that you have already figured out that night time is the best for using a pool here in Arizona. Skin cancer is a pain in the.....derma. I have managed to avoid it, so far, but I work at not getting it.
Respectfully,
Joe
Last edited by Joe Ribaudo on Thu Aug 05, 2004 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wyatt Westwood
- Part Timer
- Posts: 88
- Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:49 pm
- Location: New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Australia
Wiz Wrote:
(Wyatt Wrote:)
... there are a few including myself that have only read what's necessary in order to keep an open mind while searching for the LDM
Wiz Wrote:
Is your mind more open the less you read?
Wyatt Writes:
I read service manuals for information all day long and only take what I need to find and diagnose the problem. If I read the whole Manual I would forget most of it in a short time.
The more clothes you stuff in your closet the less open it is.
\
To much bad or wrong Information can give preconceived thoughts that lead you to the wrong conclusions.
There is nothing wrong with reading unless it's leading you in the wrong direction.
Most of the signs and symbols books I've read are based on the field experience of others that had no books to read for insights. Those Thunters were mostly making a logical guess at what the sign or symbol represents, at best, from their in the field observations with no prior knowledge or reading. The few books I have read (about thirty or so) gave me the basics of what I needed to make up my own mind based on what I found and followed in the field. Of course, without the Internet we would all still be in the dark. I think the computer age has given us more insight and information than any books could on Thunting.
Only recently has any real archival information come to light and even it has it's flaws.
Wyatt
(Wyatt Wrote:)
... there are a few including myself that have only read what's necessary in order to keep an open mind while searching for the LDM
Wiz Wrote:
Is your mind more open the less you read?
Wyatt Writes:
I read service manuals for information all day long and only take what I need to find and diagnose the problem. If I read the whole Manual I would forget most of it in a short time.
The more clothes you stuff in your closet the less open it is.
\
To much bad or wrong Information can give preconceived thoughts that lead you to the wrong conclusions.
There is nothing wrong with reading unless it's leading you in the wrong direction.
Most of the signs and symbols books I've read are based on the field experience of others that had no books to read for insights. Those Thunters were mostly making a logical guess at what the sign or symbol represents, at best, from their in the field observations with no prior knowledge or reading. The few books I have read (about thirty or so) gave me the basics of what I needed to make up my own mind based on what I found and followed in the field. Of course, without the Internet we would all still be in the dark. I think the computer age has given us more insight and information than any books could on Thunting.
Only recently has any real archival information come to light and even it has it's flaws.
Wyatt
Wyatt Westwood wrote:The more clothes you stuff in your closet the less open it is.
To much bad or wrong Information can give preconceived thoughts that lead you to the wrong conclusions.
There is nothing wrong with reading unless it's leading you in the wrong direction.
...And the less water you put in your glass, the emptier it is. I can discard useless clothes from my closet. But not if I never put any in.
You have to input and evaluate information before you can decide if it's right or wrong. And there's nothing wrong with reading, period.
How can you know it's leading you in the wrong direction unless you see what lies in that direction? Or, if you know the proper direction and destination to begin with, why are you still searching?
You have a very strange view of things, Wyatt. But that's your right.
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Joe Ribaudo
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Where It Aint
Wyatt,
By reading as much as you can, or are capable of, you will have a better idea of "where it aint". That lets you spend more time looking where you think it is.
If you read everything that you can on the LDM, the Superstitions and the history of Arizona and Mexico, you may find common threads of evidence that narrow down your search, or perhaps, validate the existance of a mine or treasure that has always been considered legend.
On the other hand, you might just read something that will convince you that your conclusions are completely wrong.
If you find that your mind is becoming cluttered with useless information, and that you are unable to function at your best, you may be pursuing the wrong hobby.
Not reading is never a plus, in any endeavor.
Just opinion.
Joe
By reading as much as you can, or are capable of, you will have a better idea of "where it aint". That lets you spend more time looking where you think it is.
If you read everything that you can on the LDM, the Superstitions and the history of Arizona and Mexico, you may find common threads of evidence that narrow down your search, or perhaps, validate the existance of a mine or treasure that has always been considered legend.
On the other hand, you might just read something that will convince you that your conclusions are completely wrong.
If you find that your mind is becoming cluttered with useless information, and that you are unable to function at your best, you may be pursuing the wrong hobby.
Not reading is never a plus, in any endeavor.
Just opinion.
Joe
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Wyatt Westwood
- Part Timer
- Posts: 88
- Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:49 pm
- Location: New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Australia
Wiz Wrote:
You have to input and evaluate information before you can decide if it's right or wrong.
Wyatt Writes:
This is true with all known science, but, what of the unknown? Your input of knowledge can be tainted by an over bearing surge of to much meaningless info of unrequired information to fast. I looked at the known successes of others first then moved on reading some other really way out there books about Thunting that I didn't believe in at all in the beginning of my research. This came about as a result of the findings in the field, the books all changed as the signs, monuments and symbols changed.
I didn't need to read all I could find.
Wiz Wrote:
And there's nothing wrong with reading, period.
Wyatt Writes:
Right on!
Wiz Wrote:
How can you know it's leading you in the wrong direction unless you see what lies in that direction?
Wyatt Writes:
With a Book it could be like a negative skeptical nonbelieving relative going along Treasuer Hunting with you discouraging your every line of sight discovery and setting you back in your progress for months on end.
With a book it's only as good as the author or information the author has in his possession at the time it was published. You only need to use what fits in the shoe. The rest is up to you.
WIz Wrote:
Or, if you know the proper direction and destination to begin with, why are you still searching?
Wyatt Writes:
To begin with in Treasure Hunting we all have no direction. You stumble around out there looking for what's known that you read or heard somewhere and don't find it. Or, you find a known monument and symbol but some of the pieces are missing and you can't read it all the proper way. What book would you read to tell you of the unknown? There are many to find so your keep going.
The Peralta (Roseta) Stones that's what!
Wiz Wrote:
You have a very strange view of things, Wyatt. But that's your right.
Wyatt Writes:
Thank you Wiz.
You have to input and evaluate information before you can decide if it's right or wrong.
Wyatt Writes:
This is true with all known science, but, what of the unknown? Your input of knowledge can be tainted by an over bearing surge of to much meaningless info of unrequired information to fast. I looked at the known successes of others first then moved on reading some other really way out there books about Thunting that I didn't believe in at all in the beginning of my research. This came about as a result of the findings in the field, the books all changed as the signs, monuments and symbols changed.
I didn't need to read all I could find.
Wiz Wrote:
And there's nothing wrong with reading, period.
Wyatt Writes:
Right on!
Wiz Wrote:
How can you know it's leading you in the wrong direction unless you see what lies in that direction?
Wyatt Writes:
With a Book it could be like a negative skeptical nonbelieving relative going along Treasuer Hunting with you discouraging your every line of sight discovery and setting you back in your progress for months on end.
With a book it's only as good as the author or information the author has in his possession at the time it was published. You only need to use what fits in the shoe. The rest is up to you.
WIz Wrote:
Or, if you know the proper direction and destination to begin with, why are you still searching?
Wyatt Writes:
To begin with in Treasure Hunting we all have no direction. You stumble around out there looking for what's known that you read or heard somewhere and don't find it. Or, you find a known monument and symbol but some of the pieces are missing and you can't read it all the proper way. What book would you read to tell you of the unknown? There are many to find so your keep going.
The Peralta (Roseta) Stones that's what!
Wiz Wrote:
You have a very strange view of things, Wyatt. But that's your right.
Wyatt Writes:
Thank you Wiz.
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Joe Ribaudo
- Expert
- Posts: 5453
- Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:36 pm
The Trail
Jim,
What Northcutt said was: "My father and Jim Bark discovered plenty of tantalizing clues themselves over the years. These included a trail, three feet wide, worn so deeply into the rock that it must have been made ba a great many heavily loaded animals over a long period of time...."
Having found and walked that trail, nowhere near Bluff Spring Mountain, I can attest to the accuracy of his description. Many "Dutch Hunters" started out as doubters. A really good reason for reading the many LDM books, is for the sheer enjoyment of reading some really entertaining yarns dealing with one of the greatest legends of the Southwest. It is a story that is known around the world.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribaudo
What Northcutt said was: "My father and Jim Bark discovered plenty of tantalizing clues themselves over the years. These included a trail, three feet wide, worn so deeply into the rock that it must have been made ba a great many heavily loaded animals over a long period of time...."
Having found and walked that trail, nowhere near Bluff Spring Mountain, I can attest to the accuracy of his description. Many "Dutch Hunters" started out as doubters. A really good reason for reading the many LDM books, is for the sheer enjoyment of reading some really entertaining yarns dealing with one of the greatest legends of the Southwest. It is a story that is known around the world.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribaudo