One thing that has bothered me about Supe mining has been the absence of smelters in the area.
There are 'rasters found in the area yet no basic smelters to process ore.
All finds of gold are ore type finds. That is with some exceptions.
Joe and Tracy's "Cave of the Gold Bars." Ted Cox's "Bullion", and other stories point towards storing of wealth which was not necessarily found originally in the Supes.
If one is to believe the massacre story, one must also believe that the miners, of which there was a large contigent for productivity and safety, decided to haul rocks out of the mountains to some other location for processing.
Just doesn't make much sense. Any input would be appreciated
Peralta Smelters
Moderator: Jesse J. Feldman
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Smelters
Knun,
There are many reasons why you would not find smelters in the Superstitions. Fuel is the first thing that comes to mind. Chemicals would be another.
I think a lot of ore, from a deep source, would be needed before you would require a smelter. That kind of production from mines in the Superstitions would have left a mark.
Now the Coke Ovens are another matter. Perhaps we will get a chance to make that trip, while we are at Twin Buttes.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribaudo
There are many reasons why you would not find smelters in the Superstitions. Fuel is the first thing that comes to mind. Chemicals would be another.
I think a lot of ore, from a deep source, would be needed before you would require a smelter. That kind of production from mines in the Superstitions would have left a mark.
Now the Coke Ovens are another matter. Perhaps we will get a chance to make that trip, while we are at Twin Buttes.
Respectfully,
Joe Ribaudo
Smelters
Joe,
If a person was to believe there was (were) mine(s) in the Supes which produced gold one question would be how much.
If the Peraltas were there, as the story goes, it was profitable enough to risk death. No matter which time frame is discussed.
All stories (that I am aware of) of the Peraltas involve a large group and for a relative extended period of time. This to recover wealth intended to restore an entire family to prominence past. Some say twice this attempted...by the same family.
Long enough for the Apache to form an alliance out of nothing. Family groups which did not covet this territory other than for spiritual reasons and the kill rallied together and slaughtered an entire group. In the 1840's possible, in the late 1860's maybe. Could the people who claimed the area, the Yavapai, do this?
Awh, back to my question. Would the Mexicans haul ore out of the mountains? Joe, you say fuel would be a concern. What did La Barge, Fish Creek, and Willow Canyons look like back then. The banks of the Salt? The iron wood?
As for chemicals, are they needed to get to a point were you can haul? Not necessarily. Intense heat could get you to that point with leftovers for the next trip.
I just have a hard time with the ore idea. I guess I'm looking for an example where extensive mining by 1800 era Mexicans required hauling ore twenty plus miles to smelter in extremely hostile territory. Or more pertinent, a find of crudely smelted gold in the Supes.
If a person was to believe there was (were) mine(s) in the Supes which produced gold one question would be how much.
If the Peraltas were there, as the story goes, it was profitable enough to risk death. No matter which time frame is discussed.
All stories (that I am aware of) of the Peraltas involve a large group and for a relative extended period of time. This to recover wealth intended to restore an entire family to prominence past. Some say twice this attempted...by the same family.
Long enough for the Apache to form an alliance out of nothing. Family groups which did not covet this territory other than for spiritual reasons and the kill rallied together and slaughtered an entire group. In the 1840's possible, in the late 1860's maybe. Could the people who claimed the area, the Yavapai, do this?
Awh, back to my question. Would the Mexicans haul ore out of the mountains? Joe, you say fuel would be a concern. What did La Barge, Fish Creek, and Willow Canyons look like back then. The banks of the Salt? The iron wood?
As for chemicals, are they needed to get to a point were you can haul? Not necessarily. Intense heat could get you to that point with leftovers for the next trip.
I just have a hard time with the ore idea. I guess I'm looking for an example where extensive mining by 1800 era Mexicans required hauling ore twenty plus miles to smelter in extremely hostile territory. Or more pertinent, a find of crudely smelted gold in the Supes.
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peralta gold
knun; From everything that I have read the parelta,s just ground the ore down and took out the consontrates or the best of the ore. I don,t think they come here very often due to the indian. Maybe the did in the olden days but not so after the 1st massacure. bill