Bob Corbin - The FBI - The Stone Maps

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
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zentull
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Post by zentull »

Still it suggests that the stones were together which I don't believe works with the way they were designed. I still would wonder why they were left behind even more so, unless the cache was gone and they were saved for future use for another possible cache.
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Post by djui5 »

I'm with you, that they were NOT meant to be found like they were found. If stolen from the Church, it's possible. If buried in a hurry near Queen Creek for whatever reason, hoping to come back soon and get them, it's possible.

Either way, they were not found where the map maker intended them to be found. The heart was meant to be kept with the maker/miner at all times, as it's the "key" to these particular stones. They were probably planning to keep the stones in a seperate place, each hidden individually, and the heart kept with the owner/map maker/etc at all times, and passed down through the family/whatever.

Either way, they are here now.

But what if, what if there are more maps to be found? What if this isn't it?

8O 8O
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Post by zentull »

The fact that they exist much like the Profile map is what intrigues me. There is a very disputed history to the present day with each and each has a purpose distorted by that history.

We have copies and the originals may or not be where we think they are.

While both have led a number of people to something very real and of unknown signifigance, for the most part they are a bit of a conundrum.

A number of maps follow a similar pattern to the Stone Maps and that is curious. Which comes first? The chicken or the egg?

While it is all pure speculation, my doubts are never dispelled concerning their authenticity. The purpose and design are contaminated by the various histories and persons that have handled them.

Similarly, if there is a map that pinpoints the LDM location, it would have come from Waltz only. The LDM to the Peraltas or any one else at the time would have had an impermanent importance.
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Post by TC ASKEY »

Zentull,

No matter what you have read on this forum, theProfile Map does pertain to the Superstitions. You can believe what you want. I can promise you that I am not the only one that knows it's location.
I will tell you this. The location is nowhere near Ruth's camp at Willow Spring nor where his remains were found. I would be willing to bet Ruth never laid eyes on the place.

You may need to look a little deeper into the Stone Map subject.
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Post by djui5 »

Yeah, I agree the profile map pertains to the Superstitions. Not as sure as TC about the area it leads to though, as I haven't seen it for myself.

I'll discount Willow Springs after I thoroughly search the area...

I wouldn't take that map at face value if I were anyone....
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Post by zentull »

Looking deeper can lead to obsession which can lead to mistakes. Things are what they are no matter how much you want them to be something else.

Even if Ruth had the profile map, he may have not realized what it meant.
It lead Magill to a pit and a cave. He believed in his interpretation for a number of years. There were a number of Dutch Hunters who were upset he was the one who figured it out. They would now tell you they knew better regardless of what they said or did in the that time frame.

I have seen Joe twist and turn in the wind over the years in his interpretation of what the Maps may mean.

He is not alone.

Interpreting that something leads to a specific place means little. The place was there all along anyways.

The Stone Maps exist and lead to a place. That place serves or served a purpose. For whom and why is the question that can only be speculated on I suppose.

I am making an effort since the forum is geared towards this topic anymore. I feel as though I am paddling upstream, when I should go with the current, but my Mom always said I never did things the easy way.
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Post by TC ASKEY »

Zentull,

You are correct with your last statement about the Stone Maps. So far no one has produced anything.
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The Stone Maps

Post by eldorado »

Stella Hawkins library.

Makes Mr. K and Mr. C insignificant.

Really believe these fine examples of Arizona, all of them, manhood have the marbles to pull this off?

The difference between knowledge and belief can send you in a different direction at the same time. Not a bad scam.


E.
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Post by TC ASKEY »

Randy,

What I would not take at face value is the new map that came from Gene Reynolds or The " Secret Directions " that Peter edited from his original post on the other website.

I do not mean to be disrespectable to ayone but I am really suprised how a few people from Treasure Net floated in to this website and became the leading authorities.

I'm sure Corbin, Kollenborn And Aurum are really shaking in their boots!!
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Post by djui5 »

Musta missed the "secret directions"....


shucks
:lol:
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Deleated?

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Wow!

Who would have thought that Peter would deleat his own post? :lol:

The more things change, the more they stay the same. Better get used to it.

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"Leading Authoities"

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

Hope all is well with you, and your not freezing your ass off. :lol:

I would not sell these newcomers short. They have the energy and imagination of youth on their side.

I don't really believe for a moment, that the FBI ever had anything to do with the Stone Maps, just as I don't really believe anyone with credentials will sign their name to a document authenticating their age.

If Mike comes up with some kind of paper trail, it will be something that has eluded "others" for a long time.

If the FBI never examined the Stone Maps, that does not bode well for the Corbin "letter".

It will be interesting to see what he comes up with.

Take care,

Joe
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Post by zentull »

The ones who stick around develop a relationship with those mountains that last a lifetime. I still have time on my side, but I also have great memories with friends 2 and 4 legged that have nothing to do with the LDM, but everything to do with good times. I would never want to deny that or neglect anyones interest in what I have experienced.

The legends are all gone and a large part of the truth that matters with them. If there were no next generation, then the stories would be forgotten and quite possibly the answers would never be found.

That being said, the Treasure net guys are a bit of an odd group.

No offense Randy, I believe you are well integrated here and are part of the dysfunctional family this forum is.
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Post by djui5 »

No offense Randy, I believe you are well integrated here and are part of the dysfunctional family this forum is.
None taken, I was here before I was there :)

I've been "odd" for a long time now, huh Joe :lol: :lol:
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Post by Mike McChesney »

Hey Zentull,

I resemble that remark! :D :D :D

The thing that makes TNet so odd is the sheer numbers of members. When you have that many people, you also get a proportionate amount of kooks! It's still a good site though. A lot of good people.

I don't remember if I was there or here first.

Hey Randy,

Any word from your newest bestest buddy? Today's supposed to be the day, isn't it?

Best,

Mike
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Post by djui5 »

Nope
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De Grazia

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

"Aylor is definitely in the time frame. Not real sure about De Grazia. I would think Joe would have that information. If not Joe, you might check with Aurum."

I thought maybe Kraig Roberts would reply, but the answer is yes,
De Grazia was in the Superstitions in the correct time frame.

Have a Merry Christmas!

Joe
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Post by Mike McChesney »

On another forum, Joe called my attention to a post I made on 23 Sept 06 in response to a post by Roger. After rereading it, I realized that I was somewhat rude. I just want to apologize to Roger for that. There was no reason for me to be insulting. I don't think it was my intention at the time, but it does look that way.

What I said in my post was true, but how I said it was rude.

Sorry Roger

Best,

Mike
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Gentleman

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Mike,

You are a true Gentleman. I, pretty much, have a lock on the rude title. You will need to work much harder, and longer, to displace me. :)

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Post by Mike McChesney »

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

I bow to the king!

Best,

Mike
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No Offense Taken

Post by Roger »

Mike, have forgotten whatever you posted at this point so no offense taken on my part. I think the Forum has gotten back to "semi-civilized" and things are running OK.

Thanks for the apology.

Roger
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Old Friends

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Roger,

Good to see an old friend still visits the LDM Forum.

Hope all is well with you and the family. Lots of bad weather in Texas lately.

The management here has taken a small amount of control over folks like me, and that is a good thing.

Take care,

Joe
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Story of how the Peralta stones were found

Post by Oroblanco »

Haven't stopped by here in a while, being one of those who "drifted in from Treasurenet" out of mutual interest and curiosity. I have a single question.

What is the source of the version of the stone maps being found or stolen from a mission in Arizpe?

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Sources

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Oroblanco,

We are not allowed to ask for sources concerning any "historical" statements made on this Forum. I did, and the Forum has never been the same.

As far as I know, the first "public" exposure of this story came from Azmula. He, and a number of other members took high offense to my asking for the source of that story......and I was under constant attack for a number of years. My (too direct) manner may have contributed to that unrelenting storm.

Azmula asked the membership to critique his series of detailed "historical" posts, and left the building in a foul mood when I obliged him. His friends never forgave me.

Since that time, I have questioned the "historical facts" of others.....with the same results. There is now another forum which, I assume, does not allow such bad mannered questions. Azmula posts there on a regular basis, and I believe his "facts" are accepted without question as being historically correct.

The "Apache Kid" :roll: posted the address of the new site on the Treasure Net Forum.

The best thing for you to do, would be to join that forum, and ask for the source for the story directly from Azmula. On second thought......that might not be a good idea. :lol:

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FBi Investigation in 1966

Post by novice »

Gregory Davis contacted Bob Corbin twice regarding the FBI and the Stone Maps.

On April 29, 2005, Bob wrote, “…..one of the deputy U. S. Attorneys told me that an FBI agent from the FBI laboratory in Washington D. C. was in their office. Apparently, the Phoenix office had obtained the stone maps to have them analyzed by the FBI laboratory to see if they were recent fakes.”

On June 4, 2007, in a telephone call, Gregory reported that Bob told him basically the same story, but in this case he added “(Bob told me that the maps were physically sent back to the Washington DC lab)” also Bob “further said that the maps were sent to the Washington DC lab because the Phoenix FBI lab was not equipped to analyze them.

I was working on the Glen Magill and Adolph Ruth connection and I ran across a newspaper article which I felt might shed some light on the circumstances under which the FBI might have been involved with the stone maps. Bob gave the time frame for the meeting as 1966-69 when he was serving as County Attorney.

In the June 10, 1966 issue of the Apache Sentinel (Apache Junction) Page One headline read;

FBI Starts Sweeping Probe Of Dutchman Mine “Frauds”

The article goes on to state Declining to name the groups involved, the FBI agent said the operators of the frauds “announce the discovery of a Bonanza, usually called the Lost Dutchman, and bilk thousands of dollars out of gullible get-rich quick investors.”

It doesn’t prove the FBI was involved with the stone maps during this time frame but it doesn’t require a giant leap to suspect they may have been, especially in light of the timeframe, the sweeping FBI investigation and the firsthand account of Bob Corbin.

Also we know that some of the MOEL investors were very unhappy about losing their money. Clarence Mitchell indicates in correspondence that he no longer had the maps by this time. MOEL may have gladly provided the maps to the FBI?

Gregory suggested that someone contact the FBI offices in Washington D. C. to find out what the results were. Maybe those searching before, who say there are no records, were too specific in their search since it appears the investigation included many groups and the stone maps would have been part of a much larger investigation.

Also if no criminal charges were filed against anyone, would those records have been retained?

Question:

Who were some of the other groups that might have been part of the FBI investigation in 1966. (Besides MOEL and Magill) Was Richard Peck’s group a candidate? Any others?

Garry
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