What would you do? Just curious!

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
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2016Producer
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What would you do? Just curious!

Post by 2016Producer »

Let's just say that you have found the Lost Dutchman Mine.... Let's say that it is located on USFS land (heavy battle to even dig)....Let's say that your getting old... And let's say that you need heavy equipment to make it work (No nuggets sitting on the ground).....

Where would you go with this?
1.) TV show?
2.) Sell it?
3.) Build a team to work it? ( after the USFS approvals given)
4.) Other ideas?
don
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by don »

keep it a secret .then arrange for someone with bicknells newspaper article in his pocket to get beheaded at the location.....then go round carving the word "oro" on every rock i could find....write a book about it ,then sell the location of the "mine" to the richest village idiot i could find.
ok its a pretty silly answer to an even stupider question,but as for the options given 1. weve allready had a pretty moronic tv series made ...and an equally stupid film made "lust for gold". i think enough is enough as far as films or tv series are concerned.
2. sell it? ....
3.build a team?
4. other ideas?
ill leave others to address the remaining 3 options ....if anyone can be bothered
Don update your email address
2016Producer
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by 2016Producer »

It is always good to hear from you British Limey's! God Bless The Queen! .... I would doubt that you have ever had the joy and fun of dealing with the US Government's red tape system. I also doubt that your blood has ever dripped onto the Superstition soil. Those who have been there know what I mean!

However, your sarcasm actually helps to support the need for the question. There has been a preponderance of TV shows, articles, and books on the subject, none of which have led to the discovery of the lost mine!

In fact, there are many lost mines. Few ever think about the complications that occur once a treasure has been found. It seems that almost immediately, there is a lawsuit filed against you. Mel Fisher was sued by the State of Florida, Oak Island has the Nova Scotia Government all over them, The group in the English Channel has been challenged by several sources, and many others. At a minimum, there are numerous layers of red tape. At the present time, it takes about 2 years to obtain permission to dig a hole in the protected US desert areas. That is only after you post a performance bond (or cash deposit), accept responsibility for any needed fire suppression (Hundreds of thousands of $$), pay for a costly environmental report, contained any and all fuels, and accounted for every pile of dirt you move. Of course, you must fill it back in each time.

Let's examine the option of "Keeping your mouth closed". On the surface, that is not a bad idea. The problem is that time runs against you. Apache Junction is full of old prospectors who can no longer climb the mountains. You get to sit around and tell stories! Also. funding is very difficult obtain, even with established credibility. Trying to sneak in on government land at night can get you killed. Those guys have excellent IR and Night Vision!
Some guy tried it recently on the face of the Superstition Mountain. It did not go well for him. The BLM has scheduled night flights over the area.

So , I ask again, "What's a guy to do?"

(Yeah, I know, take up fishin instead)
Cubfan64
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by Cubfan64 »

you're not getting many responses because the options are very limited and pretty obvious - in fact you've covered them.

If you think there is something buried on USFS land you can...

1) Spend time and $ trying to convince Federal agencies to allow you to dig there

2) Break the law and dig there without going through the red tape and risk fines and prosecution

3) Write a story or try to convince someone willing to write a book, movie or TV show about what you think you found without ever being able to prove you found it by showing what's buried there

4) Live the rest of your life content in the knowledge that you know where riches in gold and/or treasure are and go on to other things

There isn't much room for any rational discussion.
don
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by don »

producer 2016
as everybody knows ,or should know there are very good reasons why folk are not allowed to dig mine shafts and such like willy nilly in wilderness areas or national parks without very good reason and of course,permission. i guess it can be compared to me breaking into your house while youre on vacation and finding a gold ingot in your attic which had belonged to the previous owner ,and that you didnt know was there.....and then complaining how unfair it is that ive been arrested for theft.you mentioned the oak island "treasure" which is a classic case of a total waste of time ,money and resources ..and a waste of tv time too...if they dig down any deeper ,they will eventually emerge somewhere near new guinea id expect
as for "god save the queen",well,good luck with that one...i doubt if more than 1% of folk over here care if she is saved or lost.
Don update your email address
cuzzinjack
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by cuzzinjack »

2016Producer:

You, don, and Cubfan paint a pretty grim picture with few options.

Throughout history, the prospectors that have made the great discoveries have most often gotten screwed. Keeping that in mind, the discoverer should be particularly alert for those that are experts at acquiring properties for pennies on the dollar.

Bicknell described the Lost Dutchman Mine as part of a “District”, and in 1893, “District” meant a “Mining District”, meaning there is ore in quantities that requires the development of many mines.

The prospectors that “gave it away” most often did not grasp the scope of what they had found and/or they wanted instant gratification. For this, they died penniless. The discoverer of the Lost Dutchman Mine must realize that something much greater exists: a Mining District.

It is true that the process to gain permission to conduct exploration on Federal Land (Public Land) has gotten completely out of hand. But, it is believed that there is a way to remedy this. The golden rule for the prospector that finds the Lost Dutchman District is: Do not get greedy.

The concept put forth is to get outside of the “Mining Company” paradigm. Assign a large part of, or most of, the ownership and proceeds from the mining to the State of Arizona. There would be conditions, however, to ensure that this vast sum of money was not “pissed away”. The operation would be kept private, and the money would not be siphoned-off by banks and large investors. The delineation, engineering, mining, and management would be contracted, and for the most part, the money would be kept within the State.

It is common for the Federal Government and States to do land swaps, and that is what is what is proposed here. The State of Arizona would determine what is best for the State of Arizona, and not what is best for special interest groups.

The photo below was taken yesterday on the “saddle” in the middle of the cave zone described in “The Great Mine” thread. There is a bumper crop of saguaro fruit this year, despite the drought. The birds that remain have eaten so much that they can barely fly. In this case, it is likely the bird consumed so much that it could not fly at all. This is just an example of the perils of being greedy.

Image

cuzzinjack
2016Producer
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by 2016Producer »

Thank you Cuzzin!

Your response shows wisdom and experience! It is certainly true that where one ore vein has been found, there are doubtless others nearby. As they are found and developed, and a few placer sites join in, a mining district is usually created. But let me add this analogy...when hunting, it is best to fully understand the nature of your prey!

Most of the LD prospectors complained of being followed. Many also expressed fear of being bushwhacked. There is physical danger as well business-corporate dangers. One might get the feeling that the whole world is out to get them! lol

Your idea of making a deal with the state is truly unique. Perhaps it would be better to make the deal with the Feds since most of the area is a national forest? The whole issue gets snared up in nets by; bird habitats, archaeological sites, fire danger zones, extreme conservationists, environmental impact surveys, and of course political currents. By the way, are you aware that last year, Senators Flake and McCain traded about 2400 acres of prime copper bearing land near Indian leap for about 5,300 acres of non productive remote desert land? The prize was given to an Australian mining firm. I wonder why they did that? https://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/29/opin ... -land.html

So Cuzzin, not to be grim, it is a very bleak looking picture. What would be many men's dream could quickly become their worst nightmare!
2016Producer
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by 2016Producer »

PS. I was told by a wise old Indian Chief that bird feathers cause baaaad indigestion!
holyground
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Re: What would you do? Just curious!

Post by holyground »

One backpack at a time.
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