Julia Thomas

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
LDM
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Julia Thomas

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German Immigrants

Post by S.C. »

A thing to take note of is that in the 1800s - in the decades prior to the time frame of US Civil War - say, 1825 to 1855 - mainland Europe was in an uproar. And Germany was not a "nation" or "country" as we know it now. It consisted of many principalities and fifedoms. All bickering and fighting - drafting men endlessly for what amounted to senseless petty wars. As a result of politics, war, rivalries, and famines there was rampant poverty and all sorts of other evils.

Needless to say, as many probably already know, those we perceive of as "Germans" therefore had much incentive to come to America. There were several areas in the US that German immigrants tended to mirgrated to such as in Missouri along the Missouri River. Many German imigrants had come to the US and "made it big" (by European standards) - and wrote home about it. And many wrote books espoucing the "wealth to be had" in America were circulating in the area. This looked good to many - and thus there were many many Germans that wanted to come to the US.

However, in order to even get to the US many had to book passage with companies in which they could pay-off their fares by working on plantations or farms once they got to America. These plantations, of course, tended to be along large rivers such as the Missisippi. This explains why many German immigrants ended up in Missisippi and Lousiana. And this also explains why many came to the US via the port of New Orleans. However, to many, these places were only temporary "stopping points" - where they'd work off their debts and move on to where they really wanted to go.

Bearing this in mind, it makes perfect sense for Kaln, at that particular time, to be where he was. And, if he was one of those happy with where he was - and had no reason to move on - he would have done what he did and stayed in the region.

So, if one wonders why a German would end up there - at that particular time - there are many reasons for such to happen.
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German immigrants.

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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

To LDM: Thanks for the great post. Lost of good information to think about. Just one comment regarding your statement in paragraph three. Tom Glover, Helen Corbin, S.C have all been to my home and have examined my collection of documents pertaining to Julia. Novice, LDM, and anyone else is invited to come by to view this material. So anyway we have indeed talked and shared what we have learned. Keep up the good research work and sharing it on this site. You to S.C., Cordially, Greg Davis
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Julia Thomas

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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM; Larry Steinegger and Victor Kramer are the only persons who I have interview. Larry was sometime in the 1990's. Victor in 1989. Marie Steinegger was still alive at the time but Victor said she was not well enough for visitors. Vistor said nothing about his mother Hilda Kramer so I assumed she had passed away prior to our visit. Victor did not say much about Julia. He was more interested in talking about Caroline and the children of Emil Thomas. It appears that all of Emil's childern died at an early age in Washington. I still need to varify this comment. There are a few items about Julia which I have not made public for they were given to me in confidence. Only the person who gave me the material can authorize their releace. All but a couple have now been reviled on this internet site. Cordially, Greg Davis
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM; You are correct in that Emil Thomas ran a business at the Pike in Long Beach. He had a "Candy Butcher Shop" at 125 Pike. He also had an ice cream parlor across the street. There is a post card showing a picture of Emil Thomas in his candy store in the Steinegger collection in the library at the Arizona Historical Society, Central Branch, Papago Park. I do not think he died in Long Beach. He was living in San Diego, Calif in 1930 at 869 C-Avenue with his wife Leona. According to a note in the Steinegger collection he died on November 22, l930. I have been trying to get a copy of his death certificate but it is not on the Calif. Death Index Records. It must have been missed when they made the index. I have an inquiry out to the Dept. of Vital Records asking them to go over the originals in an attempt to locate it. I also have a request out to locate his probate papers, if they exist. Cordially, Greg Davis
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM: P.S. During my interview with Victor Kramer he suggested that I contact a John Halderman of Phoenix who he thought might have some pictures of the place where Julia and Emil had their store in the Capitol Block. I never carried through with his suggestion. Do you know this person? He also gave the names of Emil's daughters, They were Emma and Lina. Lina died early so it was probably Emma who survived. According to the 1900 census the Thomas' had had two children non of which were living. One of the daughters was born on April 16,1898. The Thomas' son died around September 1, 1898, give a day or two. (Tom Glover located those dates). I cannot find Emil on the 1910 census. The 1920 census shows no children living with them. Victor indicated that the girls came to Phoenix to live with the Steinegger's when thet were quite young. There might be some record of Lina having died in Phoenix. I don't know. Thomas' wife's name was Leontina E. Bena. She was born in Austria. Cordially Greg Davis
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM: Emil's probate papers, if they exist; (I.E. If he had no property then their would be no probate), will most likely be found in the Superior Court of Orange or San Diego County's. Cordially, Greg Davis.
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Emil Thomas

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With all of the new possibilities that LDM has laid out in the past couple of weeks, to say the least I'm overwhelmed. The research avenues seem almost endless.

The only information I had been able to find on Emil Thomas was from the 1900 (Lewis County, Washington) and the 1920 and 1930 San Diego, California census information. Greg has pretty well summed all of that up! I didn't know Lena's maiden name (Bena). (Couldn't find Emil in 1910 either)

Some of the additional information taken from the census that I found interesting;

Lena and Emil apparently married about 1893 or 1894 and Lena was 15. Emil was about 20 years her senior. Emil left Phoenix in March of 1890 (Divorce Record) and the story was he left with another woman. If that story is true, it seems obvious that Lena was not the other woman.

In Washington State, 1900, Emil was listed as a Saloon Keeper but in 1920 and 1930 he was back in the Baker Trade. In 1920 he had his own Bakery and in 1930, he was working as a Baker in a Hotel. Lena was working as a Dressmaker in the home. (Coronado City) Is there a timeframe associated with the post card? How early would Emil have been in Long Beach?

The year of arrival in the United States listed for Emil is 1868, 1871, and 1872. I have been unable to locate Emil in the 1880 census and he should be there. If someone has located that information I would appreciate a heads up. This might shed some light on how Julia and Emil ended up in Mitchell County, Texas when they were married in 1883.

In 1930 the Thomas's owned their home in San Diego and it was valued at $5,000. If he died in 1930, perhaps the probate would be in San Diego County. If there were children, it might identify them. (Good luck on your search!)

Greg, the Californina death index I have access to through Ancestry.com appears to start in 1940, which might explain why Thomas is not there?

Garry
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

Garry: The post card is dated April 13, 1911 and was sent by Thomas to Mrs. A. Steinegger, Phoenix, Arizona. Emil and Leontina were married in the city of Chelalis, Lewis County, State of Washington. on August 20th. 1894. In 1907 Emil was mentioned in a newspaper article as the owner of the Opera House in Centralia Washington. He was also granted U.S. Citizenship on August 6th. 1896, Lewis County, Washington by Judge Langhorne. Cordially, Greg Davis
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM, Novice, S.C., Aurum, and anyone else who is interested: It appears that all of us have hit a brick wall while attempting to locate Emil Thomas on the 1910 Census. Once last night at midnight, While dreary and half asleep, I ponder this quaint and curious issue, Then there came a tapping, a gently rapping against the inside of my cranial wall. "Light Bulb". It appears that there are three possibilities which could have happened. 1. Emil was out of town when the census was taken. 2. He was in the middle of a move at Long Beach from one residence to another when the census was taken. 3. Or the census taker mis-spelled his name. If the last possibility is the case then there is a way to locate him. Each census taker was assigned a Ward, District, Precinct, etc. They would then go up and down each street of their assignment taking the census. Fortunately for us the census taker was required to put the name of the street and address of the dwelling along the left margin of the census sheet. Now, according to the 1911 Long Beach City Directory, Emil is listed at both Pine and 105 Pike. Pine and Pike are no longer listed as streets on the current maps. They most likely were streets associated with the Long Beach Pike. One will have to locate a 1910 city map of Long Beach to find those streets. Remember that the information for a 1911 directory would have been gathered in 1910. As of April 13th. l911, Emil gave his address as 1406 Atlantic Ave. Long Beach, Calif. That street and location are still on the map. What one needs to do is find our how the 1910 Wards were divided and along what street lines. There is a way to do this but I do not know how. Once the ward is located it's just a matter of finding the street name in the left margin of the census and following it down to the street number and seeing who is listed as living at that location. If Emil was in town his name should show up on one of the three streets. Comments anybody? (poetry not included), Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
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Emil Thomas

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Emil Thomas

Post by novice »

Don't know whether this is our Emil Thomas in 1910 but a lot of things fit. There are also some discrepancies, but census information is notoriously inaccurate.

There was an Amil Thomas in the 3rd Ward (Long Beach) in Los Angeles County. (Enumeration District 40, Page 26B). He was listed as single, 51 years old and both he and his parents were born in Germany. The address is hard to read but it appears to be 126 Pine Avenue. Amil was listed as a retired merchant and the business was a confectionary.

Perhaps he came to California alone and was in the process of setting up a business and Lena was still in Washington State? I haven't found her in Washington in 1910 though. The ancestry.com index for 1910 is for the heads of the household only. She could have been living with someone else waiting for Emil to send for her?

The Pine Avenue information from LDM and the Confectionary business are compelling. I am leaning toward believing that this is our Emil Thomas. Take a look and see what you guys think.

Garry
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM and Novice: Absolutely, incredible, GREAT work!!! First for LDM. The Long Beach City directory for 1911 listing Emil at Pine Ave did not give an address number. Be sure to read the last post by Novice before going to Long Beach tonight. Novice located the address on the 1910 census as 126 Pine Ave. I went back to my map for Long Beach, which is a 1990 Thomas Guide, but it does not show Pine or Rainbow Harbor. I believe that was the time they were changing streets in the area of the old Pike. I will have to get a new map of the area that shows them. Enjoy your drive tonight to Long Beach. Novice; There is no doubt in my mind that you have found Emil Thomas in the 1910 census for I have seen his name spelled Amil. One can well realize how the census taker made the spelling error in his name. Sorry I do not remember where I saw that spelling. The rest of it fall right into place. Emil was retired from the confectionary business at that time. He had been operating the opera house in Centralia, Washington and was running it at least into 1908. The census taker could have easily misuderstood Emil's German accent and thought it sounded like Amil and that he said he was retired, or made the wrong entry in the wrong column on the census form. Again, Great research work by you two men. Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
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Post by Wiz »

This thread is the most incredible, impressive display of researching skill I've ever had the privilige of seeing. Thank you all, gentlemen, for going through it all online like this, and demonstrating what's really possible on a forum like this.
Novice, you are a force to be reckoned with. Greg and LDM were already known as research powerhouses, but you have sailed right into the top ranks in the few weeks you've been posting here.
Congratulations, welcome, and please carry on!
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

Wiz; Thank you for the kind words for all of us. When did Emil move from Washington to Long Beach? Now that he has been located on the 1910 census, we know he was in Long Beach by 1910. During my research many years ago I noticed that Emil did not appear on the 1910, 1909, and 1908 Long Beach City Directories. We know he was still in Washington in November of 1907 and most logically still there in 1908. Novice, Check the date that the census taker listed Emil. If I recall, most census were taken early in the year. If that is the case then Emil most likely made the move from Washington to Long Beach in late 1909. If it were early 1909 the he would have been picked up on the 1910 city directory. If we can narrow it down to a month or so then one can go to the Chehallis Bee newspaper and see if there is a mention of the Thomas' leaving Centralla for Long Beach. Another place that he may show up is in the Long Beach business tax records and California state property tax records provided he owned property. Did he advertise in the local paper while operating his business at the Pike? Food for though. Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
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Post by novice »

Wiz,

There's an old saying that we learn more and more about less and less until we know everything about nothing. I hope that's not necessarily the case here?

Greg

The 1910 census was to reflect the status of the person on April 15 and in our case Amil was enumerated on May 5, 1910.

The problem with the 1910 census is that we still have no hint that Emil had any children?

I have tried to locate Emil in the 1880 census but have always came up empty. According to later census information Emil stated that he arrived in the United States by 1872. I tried once again using the LDS 1880 census site. They are much more forgiving regarding the first name than the other services (Ancestry.com and Genealogy.com) which require the exact spelling. I got 22 hits for Emil Thomas but only one that comes close to fitting our Emil.

I want to emphasis that this Emil is not absolute!

An Emmil [sic] Thomas was listed in Davidson County, Tennessee, Ward 15 (Enumeration District 61, Page 40). He was 24 years old and born in Germany. In the 1900 Washington census Emil gave his birth as June 1856 which would be in agreement with the 24 years old and of course he was born in Germany. He was listed as single (Emil married Julia in 1883).

The kicker is that Emmil was in the Tennessee State Penitentiary. in Nashville. There was also a notation that Emmil could neither read nor write. Don't know how meaningful that was as that's the way most of the prisoners were listed. Maybe just another census mistake?

There were over 1,000 prisoners listed and only three Germans. Conrad Kessler (46) a Baker, Jonathan Benny (23) no occupation, and Emmil Thomas (24) no occupation.

I would not dismiss out of hand that this could not be our Emil.

Did the 1896 Naturalization provide any additional hints as to Emil's previous activity?

I have been unable to find Emil arriving in the U. S. He would have only been about 15 years old and he apparently didn't come with his family since his Sister Caroline didn't arrive until 1885?

Garry
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Emil Thomas

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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

LDM; Thank you for the report on the various addresses of Emil Thomas while he was living in Long Beach, Calif. Did you ever ask Hida Kramer which port Emil went through when he came to the U.S., and the name of the ship in which he sailed. Novice, Tom Golver is looking up the naturalization papers for Emil Thomas. Tom lives in that part of the country and is more familiar with where the various documents are kept and which governtment agencies need to be contacted for the material. I looked up the address for the Tennessee Department of Correction on the net. All requests for hitorical items must be submitted in writing. I will do so and ask for the date Emmil Thomas was released from prison. If the date is before December 1883, I will then go back and request his prison record. One more item; I went back through my interview with Victor Kramer and he said that the Thomas' original name was "PHOMA". LDM correct me on this if I incorrectly quoted Victor. Cordially Gregory E. Davis
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Prison Record

Post by novice »

Greg,

If you haven't already sent your request to the Department of Corrections, you may want to wait. I sent my $10 to the Tennessee State Library and Archives today and they are providing some kind of state prison record though it will be 4 to 6 weeks.

If you look at their web site you can probably figure out what I ordered. It may be the same thing you are getting.

Garry
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Post by Gregory E. Davis »

Gentlemen: I ran across a site that just may explain why Emil Thomas moved to Centralia, Washington. It is www.bukovinasociety.org Then go to SEARCH, Type in "Lewis County Washington". Stroll down to "Bukovina-Germans in Lewis County Washington, Mary Lee Rose (publ l995) and open the site. Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
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Bena Family

Post by novice »

Greg,

Enjoyed the background information on the Bukovina people. You are surely correct when you state the reason for the Bene family being associated with Lewis County, Washington. In the article, Mary Rose lists the Bukovina German Surnames and their villages of origin. The village listed for the Bena family was Gurahumora.

I located a ship's passenger list apparently recording the arrival of our Leontina Bene. The family arrived April 24, 1888 in New York on the Steam Ship Fulda. Andreas Bene (45), Marie (46), Barbara (17), Rosalia (15) Anna (8) and Leontina (8). The family was immigrating from Austria. This also fits the time frame for the Immigration to Lewis County.

I guess I'm still not sure what drew Emil Thomas to Lewis County, Washington State. The only record I have for his birth place is the Death Certificate for his sister Caroline on which it lists Baden Germany as her birth place? Perhaps you have some further information?

I have tried searching for the Bena family in census records and have came up empty. They may have moved or changed the spelling of their last name. It appears that many, if not in most cases, the Austrian names were Anglicized. I don't know now the name was pronounced but a search on Bena using the LDS 1880 census yielded several possible spellings, a couple of which were Beny and Benny?

Garry
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