Enough is enough

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
Post Reply
Wiz
Expert
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri May 24, 2002 2:55 am

Enough is enough

Post by Wiz »

OK, I've been registered on this web site for over a year. I've engaged in some discussions, and bandied some points.
But this site is run by Ron Feldman. Tom Kollenborn is a partner with Ron. These guys are two of the most intimately-involved Dutch hunters in the business, yet they say nothing.

This entire forum is looking very much like a bulletin board to allow Ron and his friends to keep tabs on the mountain news. Come on, Ron, when are you going to contribute something? Tom, when are you going to say something beyond re-telling some of the old stories like Hacksaw Tom and Bill Jenkins? We've all read Thunder God's Gold. Do you guys ever intend to do more than just watch for a bit of information to pass by? Are you ever going to add anything of your own? Guys like Peter, SC, and Joe have been pretty much carrying this site by themselves. How about a little support from the management?

Anyone else agree with this?
Mark
Greenhorn
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 7:19 pm
Location: Globe, Arizona

enough is enough

Post by Mark »

Wiz,

add to that list the Superstition Mountain Historical Society which has a forum of it's own on this website but is always silent except for when somebody steps on it's toe.

Ron could add a lot to this forum, his treasure trove and other interests come to mind.

Many folks monitor the forum on a regular basis but never add input to any of the discussions or pass on information or data they might have to offer. It would be helpful if others would offer their knowledge but they have no obligation to join in if they don't want to. I think azmula's articles about the stone maps have been among the most interesting and informative pieces of information anyone has contributed. My hat is off to azmula for his unselfish sharing of his research and theories.
Wiz
Expert
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri May 24, 2002 2:55 am

Post by Wiz »

Mark,

Well said, I completely agree. The SMHS is not in the Dutch hunting business (supposedly), but they could certainly contribute some historical stuff. Azmula made a big leap of faith sharing so much of his research with us. I hope that faith is rewarded by some kind of response. I know of a couple of other Stone Map guys that could get a real dialog going.

But considering the lack of input from the guys running the show, I wouldn't blame them a bit if they took it all offline. It seems like these guys are just sitting back and picking our brains. Ron has made a couple of non-committal entries. Kollenborn has said nothing except to rehash stuff he wrote years ago.

We have had a few real heavyweights pass through, but they have all sized up the situation quickly and moved on. What we have left are a few guys fishing for information, talking a lot and saying nothing. I don't exclude myself from this. But I don't have the pedigree that Ron and Tom have. These guys could share some stuff that wouldn't jeapordize their searches, but they don't.
Peter
Expert
Posts: 506
Joined: Sun May 19, 2002 7:47 am

Post by Peter »

Wiz,

Something to keep in mind is the fact that Ron originally started this website to promote his business and hawk a book or two. I am not too sure about the number of books he has sold via the site, but I don't believe it is too many. The fact that he CONTINUES to run and support the website (they aint free) is a contribution in itself...and a mighty strong one.

As we well know, any and all contributions from seasoned veterans, while very welcome, still arent going to put us any closer to the mine site. Heck, I imagine your guess as to the mines location would be just about as good as anyones.....maybe better.... :wink:

What interests me is the "history of the mystery" - who did what, where and why... We have some folks looking on that could contribute more to this than others.

Another point. Sometimes it is just not worth the BS that goes on here to post. I for instance, will no longer be posting about certain subjects, or answering certain individuals, just because I am tired of all the foolishness. I am sure others feel the same way and this is the reason they post rarely if at all.

In closing I think Ron deserves kudos for keeping the site going. As far as the SMHS goes, it is an entity and not an individual, and while it is composed of nice folks, many of them simply dont have the time and wherewithal to make alot of postings...leaving nuts like us to do most of the grunt work.

P
Joe Ribaudo
Expert
Posts: 5453
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:36 pm

Lack of Information

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Wiz,

For a good period of time the information that was being shared on this forum was prolific. While there was name calling, insults and derision, there was a tremendous flow of new information in the mix. The old information that was being posted was mostly rehashing of stories that anyone could read, as you have noted. The interest in the forum was as high as it has ever been, perhaps higher. Passion often reveals truth. Once the passion left, the participation dwindled.

I have no doubt that some believe that I was the cause of that lack of participation, but the historical numbers of posts and topics on the forum will show another viewpoint. When things got stale, Peter or myself would call someone an intellectual SOB (usually each other) and the passion would return. The posts that would follow would contain honest opinions and new information.

I always tried to present new topics or a totally different angle on old ones. I have been accused of fishing for information, while the truth is that I gave a great deal more than I ever received. I had a lot of fun in the process.

Expecting anyone else to carry this forum yields the results you are seeing now. Ron and Tom have put most of their ideas into print and sold them to us. Dr. Glover has done the same. It will take someone new to enter the mix now and infuse new stories and ideas to make this forum what it was. When that happens, don't do anything to impede the flow. It will end on its own.

S.C., Peter and myself have all cut back on our participation in this forum and it is waiting for that new voice to speak with new stories, ideas and fresh approaches to the old legends.

Respectfully,

Joe Ribaudo
walker12
Part Timer
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 4:19 pm

Post by walker12 »

Ditto what Peter said with one exception and one emphasis. The exception is that I really don't avoid any posters and I only avoid topics where I have little if anything to add (which is most topics). Also, I really agree with the part about the "history of the mystery". In fact I never look for monetary treasure in the Superstitions. I just enjoy the area and knowing the history of who was where, when and why adds to that.

Joe, granted you do tend to serve as a lightening rod for some. However I do believe that the Board is much better off for your thoughts and insights.
Ron
Part Timer
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 5:00 pm

enough is enough

Post by Ron »

I probaly should of started a new topic under" being wized on. "Wiz, whatever anyone donates to this site is a function of how much time they have, what they know or don't know. If you look back into the older postings , you will see some things that I have offered. It is true that I have not responded lately , but to be honest , all the "Barkleyology" gets me numb. If you don't open yourself to new possilbilities , there will never be any. Everyone is looking for the site or the new book that will lead them to the mine. Ain't going to happen. I'm not the babysitter of this site , as it doesn't require one. Use it for what it was intended. I by the way have never sold a book off this site and I don't use it to monitor the mountains. I don't care who goes in and out or when they do it. Give me abit of credit for having a bit bigger life than that. Tom is not my partner and we have actually never hunted the mine together.What he donates to this site should be appreciated and not scorned. He more than anyone has donated much of his life to this legend. So, I say this respectively, if you don't like the forum, maybe you should wiz someplace else.
Wiz
Expert
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri May 24, 2002 2:55 am

Post by Wiz »

Ron,
Well, at least I got you to talk to us!

Don't get me wrong, I don't expect you to tell your secrets. Share another viewpoint! Tell some stories! Give us something else to chew on than Barkleyology! Tell some news about your cache.
You have made postings in the past, true, and they were appreciated. But the last one was a long, long time ago. I still say that all Tom has been doing is repeating the same old stories that the tourists get. We're not new! He could spin a yarn or two as well.
It just seemed odd that two guys involved with this forum, both of whom know more than anyone else here, say the least of any of us. You have to admit that in the absence of any other information, it does look like it could be just a listening post, in case anything useful floated by.

There, I've explained my position and tried to placate you. If you would still prefer that I go "wiz" somewhere else, you're free to revoke my membership. I'll live.
If not, then talk to us!
Joe Ribaudo
Expert
Posts: 5453
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:36 pm

Just Whizin Along Here.

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Wiz,

I think Ron meant respectfully rather than "respectively" which should give you a better idea on whether he want's you to leave or not.
I am pretty sure that Ron stays somewhat busy with his business and his claim and I am also pretty sure he does not look into the forum all that often.

Do you have a source for the "partnership" you mentioned or was that an assumption? I don't know where you are from, but folks out here have a thin skin when people start making wild acusations about their motives
and friends.

A few words from you would not hurt, but I would guess that Ron has already moved on.

Anyone have a story or something new that has not been in print? Don't make me throw something else out here. I know that's what your all waiting for. :lol:

Respectfully,

Joe
Wiz
Expert
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri May 24, 2002 2:55 am

Post by Wiz »

Joe,
My source for the statement that Ron and Tom are partners is this very web site. Look at the home page "Ride with Ron and Tom into the Superstitions...". Then click the "more and reservations" button, where there are repeated references to "your professional outfitters Ron Feldman and Tom Kollenborn". This sounds like a partnership to me. If I have misinterpreted these statements, I apologize to all. But I don't think I have.

Not that there's anything wrong with this partnership! Not at all! I am just responding to your request for the source of my "wild accusations". This is a partnership, focusing on the Superstitions, between two of the top guys in the Dutch hunting field. Hmm. Were my statements really so unwarranted?

I never intended to imply that Ron and Tom were being underhanded in any way. We all watch for the stray bit of information, nothing wrong with that. They owe us nothing, and are not obliged to contribute here. But it would be nice if they did, since they have more to offer than the rest of us combined.
Peter
Expert
Posts: 506
Joined: Sun May 19, 2002 7:47 am

Post by Peter »

Wiz and Ron

It has been my pleasure to know both of you and I consider both of you
good men....and as you both know I do NOT consider ALL LDMers (some well-known ones in fact) paragons of virtue. So, with that in mind, can we all
just drop the f-ing subject. Its something that probably should not have been brought up in the first place...Wiz must have been bored..... :D

P
Joe Ribaudo
Expert
Posts: 5453
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:36 pm

Bored?

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Peter

"Wiz must have been bored..... :D "

That Wiz, just can't get in step with the rest of us. :lol:

Respectfully,

Joe
Wiz
Expert
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri May 24, 2002 2:55 am

Post by Wiz »

Story of my life, Joe.
Peter
Expert
Posts: 506
Joined: Sun May 19, 2002 7:47 am

Post by Peter »

Hahahaahhahahahaha.........
Joe Ribaudo
Expert
Posts: 5453
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:36 pm

Yes

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Peter,

Had you only changed that to ha'ah, we would have had the begining of a conversation. :lol:

Respectfully,

Joe
Ronnie Kelso
Part Timer
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2005 7:45 pm
Location: Phoenix

Post by Ronnie Kelso »

Deleted............................................................
Last edited by Ronnie Kelso on Thu Sep 21, 2006 7:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
zentull
Expert
Posts: 1039
Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 11:15 am
Location: Surprise, Arizona

Post by zentull »

I didn't know..........this explains the black outs and confusion. It also explains why I think I know something, but can't figure out why.....

We should be bumping this topic over to the boxing forum very soon I would think.
Saguaro
Greenhorn
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 9:32 am

Post by Saguaro »

worse than just someones IP address being tracked has gone on here. members private information has been accessed and personal checks into backgrounds, credit information and employment have been carried out by members of this forum either working as a group or individualy and sharing the results with certain members. i wonder who has the resources to carry out this kind of underhanded and derranged nonsense ? anyone here with ties to a Sheriffs department, PI's or ancestry.com ? 8O

personal posts have been lifted from this website, words and meaning altered, and then posted on otherwebsites as well as e-mailed to third parties for no other reason than to cause trouble and set people up for things they never said. i wonder who here has the keys to the personal information and is nuts enough to do some of these things ? 8O

ron feldman cares so little for the members that have been attacked and subject to this type of back stabbing and trickery that his only reply is to go wiz somewhere else. well ron, looks like a lot of members took your advice and a lot more may well do the same. the abuse that some of your members are STILL carrying on are in violation of your own user agreement. 8O
maybe you should go back and read your own agreement ron. 8O
Heidi II
Greenhorn
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Sep 01, 2006 8:23 am
Location: lake havasui

mean, mean, mean things

Post by Heidi II »

Oh how sad.

Bad, Bad people, doing mean mean things.

Mr. Kelso,

Do you have the rest of Mr. Ruth on ice?

His maps would lead you to the horse you took the picture of.

If so can you donate him to the museum in Apache Junction.

Oh how wonderful.


Heidi
Post Reply