Roberts Agenda

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Joe Ribaudo
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Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Larry,

Some time ago when Kraig Roberts last came on TNet I knew what was coming. When his other IDs started showing up and applauding his every post, I figured it would not be long until they came after me.

I sent Kraig a private message and told him he would not be able to run the same game at TNet as he did over on DUSA. He and all his phony alter egos flooded Jim B. with complaints about my supposed insults to posters like Spirit. All I actually did was ask him questions.

Jim told me he didn't have time to look at the offending posts so it was just easier to ban me.

Kraig and Goldmine have both been banned from TNet. Kraig should have listened to me. When he sticks to one user account, and sticks to factual history, he's very good and I am always interested in that history.

Coming to TNet with an agenda to get me banned was just sick.

Take care,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Deducer »

Joe Ribaudo wrote:When he sticks to one user account, and sticks to factual history, he's veryi good and I am always interested in that history.
Coming from someone who has also posted under multiple aliases, including a female, this post might just as well be directed towards yourself.

You too, are a repository of very useful information whenever you are able to keep your personal shortcomings in check, as has been pointed out to you many times in this forum.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

deducer,

I have only hid my identity once. I did not use that identity to attack anyone, nor to try and get someone banned. There were so many idiots, like you, attacking me here with their vile crap, that I tried to remove Joe Ribaudo from the fight. It goes on to this day with people like Kraig Roberts and you. What name were you using back then?

Keep hiding behind deducer. You're just another anonymous coward.

Joe Ribaudo
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by pippinwhitepaws »

OMG...can't this shit stop?

i am supposed to be the crazy person around here, and some people just make me seem too normal for my own good.

one of the first posts i ever made in the dutchman forums was: if you people would stop being a bunch of backstabbing little girls, the mine would have been found by now.


co operate...no one lives in a vacuum.

( well, some of you sure act like you live in a vacuum...or at least oxygen deprived.)
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

[quote="pippinwhitepaws"]OMG...can't this shit stop?

i am supposed to be the crazy person around here, and some people just make me seem too normal for my own good.

one of the first posts i ever made in the dutchman forums was: if you people would stop being a bunch of backstabbing little girls, the mine would have been found by now.


co operate...no one lives in a vacuum.

( well, some of you sure act like you live in a vacuum...or at least oxygen deprived.

Donald,

If anyone can understand how these things can spiral out of control, it's you and I.

Hope all is well with you.

Take care,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Deducer »

Joe Ribaudo wrote:deducer,

I have only hid my identity once. I did not use that identity to attack anyone, nor to try and get someone banned. There were so many idiots, like you, attacking me here with their vile crap, that I tried to remove Joe Ribaudo from the fight. It goes on to this day with people like Kraig Roberts and you. What name were you using back then?

Keep hiding behind deducer. You're just another anonymous coward.

Joe Ribaudo
Your days of dominating threads and bullying posters are over.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Deducer wrote:
Joe Ribaudo wrote:deducer,

I have only hid my identity once. I did not use that identity to attack anyone, nor to try and get someone banned. There were so many idiots, like you, attacking me here with their vile crap, that I tried to remove Joe Ribaudo from the fight. It goes on to this day with people like Kraig Roberts and you. What name were you using back then?

Keep hiding behind deducer. You're just another anonymous coward.

Joe Ribaudo
Your days of dominating threads and bullying posters are over.
You will never have any credibility until you, at least, summon up the nerve to sign your name to the bottom of your posts. until that day, you're just another anonymous coward.

Joe Ribaudo
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Deducer »

Joe Ribaudo wrote: You will never have any credibility until you, at least, summon up the nerve to sign your name to the bottom of your posts. until that day, you're just another anonymous coward.

Joe Ribaudo
Save your breath. Your bullying doesn't work on me.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

I am always amazed at how long some people can carry a grudge over some imagined slight.

If you think I'm a bully, you must really be one weak sister. This will be my last post to you, because life is too short.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Deducer »

Like I said, save your breath.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Oroblanco »

Mr Roberts recently posted on another forum that he knew Walt Gassler and was his friend; Walt died in 1984. Does anyone here know when Mr Roberts arrived in Arizona, (the year is enough)? Thank you in advance.
Oroblanco
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Oroblanco wrote:Mr Roberts recently posted on another forum that he knew Walt Gassler and was his friend; Walt died in 1984. Does anyone here know when Mr Roberts arrived in Arizona, (the year is enough)? Thank you in advance.
Oroblanco
Roy,

Court documents have Kraig stating that he "was domiciled" in Arizona from 1983. If that is not true, he can correct the record......easily.

Good luck,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Roy,

Check your email's.

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Roy,

Here's an old post from, I believe, Peter's old site:

Aurum
01-07-2007, 11:15 AM
Walter Gassler was a lifelong Dutch hunter with a passion for the mountains and the lost mine of Jacob Waltz. He was an early Dutch hunter whose search predated the death of Adolph Ruth and the tremendous notoriety and interest the Ruth saga generated. Walter knew many of the early searchers and was friends with Tex Barkley who owned the Quarter Circle U Ranch where the Dutchman mine is believed to be located.

Walter died in the Superstition Mountains on or about the 4th or 5th of May, 1984, while on a search for Waltz's mine. A lot of confusion and controversy has surrounded the death of Mr. Gassler. Some people believe Walter died while hiking into the Superstition Mountains while others blieve he may have been hiking back out of the mountains when he died. What transpired in between the time Walter left the trailhead, and when his body was discovered, is the source of much speculation and controversy.

Recently I had the opportunity to learn some details of Walter's last trip into the mountains in search of the Lost Dutchman Mine. Two men found Walters body on May 5, 1984. Those men were Don Shade and Robert Baker. A while back I listened to a tape recording of an interview in which Don Shade gave his account of the finding of Walters body.

Robert Baker was a wrangler from Colorado who at the time of Walter's death was working at the OK Corral in Apache Junction. A week before Mr. Gassler died, Baker had packed an eastern gentleman into the mountains to Charleboy spring. The eastern gentleman made annual trips to Arizona and each year would be packed back into some remote camp and spend up to two weeks in the wilderness.

On May 5, 1984, Baker and Don Shade rode into Charleyboy Spring to check on the easterner and deliver some supplies to him. As they were nearing Charleyboy, they met the easterner down in LaBarge canyon and the man immediately told Shade and Baker that there was what appeared to be a dead man along the trail above Charleyboy on the way up to Peter's Mesa. He also told Shade and Baker there were some men further up the trail. The easterner appeared shaken up and was attempting to leave the area when he ran into Shade and Baker. Don and Baker rode up the trail, past Charleyboy and found Walter Gassler body, sitting on a chair like rock about 20 feet off the trail. Shade also noticed several men milling around a couple hundred yards up the trail and recognized one of them from his size and distinctive clothing. Neither Shade nor Baker would divulge the name of the man they recognized as Shade stated he was afraid of the man and didn't want any trouble with him.

I found that chair like rock that Don Shade said Walter's body was sitting on, it is as he said about 20-30 feet off the trail above Charleyboy on the trail that leads up onto Peters Mesa.

Shade said Walter was wearing a new shirt, so new the folds were still visable in the shirt and his shoes were freshly shined.

If, as some believe, Walter spent the night camping at Charleyboy, the eastern gentleman would have seen him there, yet the man said no one camped with him at the spring. It also appears this man didn't go up to find Walter dead, he noticed a comotion on the trail and when he glassed the scene with his binoculars he saw Walter's body and several men climbing the trail above him. This testimony dispells the accepted theory that Walter hiked into Charleyboy spring, spent the night there, and died while hiking up the Peter's Mesa trail the next day.

Aurum
_____________________________________________________________

There's more from the site, but don't know if anyone's interested in that much.

Good luck,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Oroblanco »

Thank you Joe!
"We must find a way, or we will make one." --Hannibal Barca
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Roy,

Here's another:

Aurum
05-07-2008, 10:48 AM
Twenty-four years ago this week, Walter Gassler passed away in the Superstition mountains while searching for the Lost Dutchman mine. Walter was 82 years old and had been an avid Dutch hunter for over 50 years.
Some here knew Walter personally, most all here have heard of him and read his manuscript as well as read stories of his life that have appeared in numerous publications.

Walter was a kind and generous man, well liked by all who met him and a very intelligent and thoughtful person. Walter was born in Zurich, Switzerland in 1902. He had three brothers and one sister, Walter was the only member of his family to come to the United States. In 1922 he landed at Ellis Island and lived in New York for a time. He traveled and lived in New Orleans and San Francisco before arriving in Arizona to live in 1932. Walter was a chef by trade, trained in Europe and kitchens in New Orleans and San Francisco. he came to Arizona to work at the prestegious Biltmore Hotel but also prepared food at the Hyatt Regency, Paradise Valley Country Club and other fine dining establishments around the Valley of the Sun.

Not many realize Walter was not his real name. His real name was Karl. He changed it to Walter in 1942 because of his heavy Swiss (German) accent and the discrimination against German immigrants during WWII. he always went by Walter from that time on. He said it sounded more American and made him feel more accepted.

Walter learned everything he could about the Lost Dutchman mine and Jacob Waltz. He spent considerable time in the Bancroft Library in Berkley California and other repositories of books and documents, reading everything he could find about Waltz and the Peralta's and anything related to the legends and tales. He spent time in the Superstition mountains in the late 1920's before he resided in Arizona, making annual treks into the mountains searching for Waltz's lost mine. When he came to arizona to live, he spent considerable time at Tex Barkley's Quarter Circle U ranch and became close friends with Barkley and his whole family.

Walter met and married Coletta Hatfield in Phoenix in 1937. The Gasslers had two children, a boy Roland and a girl Marie. Neither Walter's wife nor their children shared Walter's enthusiasm for the mountains or the lost mine but walter continued to make annual treks into the mountains searching for the mine and short trips whenever he could get away.

On May 1, 1984, Walter Gassler made his last trek into the Superstition mountains searching for the Lost Dutchman Goldmine. On friday May 4, 1984 two men found Walter Gassler sitting on a rock along the Peter's Mesa trail just above Charley-Boy and LaBarge Canyon. Walter had died sometime before, succuming to a heart attack according to the coroners report.

The Gassler family, his friends and the dutchman community as a whole lost a good man and a good friend that day. Walter left behind a manuscript which is a treasure itself to those who follow in his footsteps. To those who knew Walter, his words and friendship and smile will always be remembered and his spirit will always be a part of the Superstition Mountains which were such an important part of his life.

Aurum
_______________________________________________

Sounds like Aurum knew that smile pretty well.

Take care,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Cubfan64 »

Oroblanco wrote:Mr Roberts recently posted on another forum that he knew Walt Gassler and was his friend; Walt died in 1984. Does anyone here know when Mr Roberts arrived in Arizona, (the year is enough)? Thank you in advance.
Oroblanco
Why not ask him?
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Cubfan64 wrote:
Oroblanco wrote:Mr Roberts recently posted on another forum that he knew Walt Gassler and was his friend; Walt died in 1984. Does anyone here know when Mr Roberts arrived in Arizona, (the year is enough)? Thank you in advance.
Oroblanco
Why not ask him?
Paul,

The obvious reason is that, at times, the moderators tend to become mind readers and decide that such questions might imply that someone has lied. It's happened to me several times.

Take care,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Cubfan64 »

That's what the PM function is for - I guess it just makes more sense to me to ask the source rather than make guesses.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Oroblanco »

Cubfan64 wrote:That's what the PM function is for - I guess it just makes more sense to me to ask the source rather than make guesses.
Mr Roberts has refused to reply to PMs I have sent him in the past, when he first joined T-net.
"We must find a way, or we will make one." --Hannibal Barca
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Oroblanco wrote:
Cubfan64 wrote:That's what the PM function is for - I guess it just makes more sense to me to ask the source rather than make guesses.
Mr Roberts has refused to reply to PMs I have sent him in the past, when he first joined T-net.
Roy and Paul,

One can never be too careful! On the other hand, I would very much like to see Mathew posting way more. Historically, he is a wealth of information. I know this because a great deal of our information comes from the same sources.

Take care,

Joe
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Cubfan64 »

Oroblanco wrote:
Cubfan64 wrote:That's what the PM function is for - I guess it just makes more sense to me to ask the source rather than make guesses.
Mr Roberts has refused to reply to PMs I have sent him in the past, when he first joined T-net.
I guess I'd try again - if no response then at least you gave it a try.
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Re: Roberts Agenda

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

12/15/15
Quote Originally Posted by Hal Croves View Post

[Not sure that I am interested in the "entire story" yet.
My questions are about the shortcuts you describe and how forgeries passed thru experienced hands unnoticed.
Its really not about blame.
I just want to know how it happened.
To understand that, we need to ask questions.

Like, is that the original forged transcription in Helen's book?
If so, it is not a very compelling attempt at a forgery.

Compare that to the experience of all those involved and we are left with a huge disconnect.

I am going to ask Matthew many things tonight in an email.
Before I do, do you know if he was compensated for the information in Helen's book?
Simple question.
Hal,]

You should absolutely do that. I have been there and done that. Here is where this little nightmare started for me:
_________________________________
Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:47 am Hello Roger:

Well, I’m not even sure where to start. The family historian? Gideon? George Riley? The family farm? Matthew Robert’s relationship to the family? Family familiarity with Dick Holmes? With Jacob Waltz? The discovery of the richest gold mine in California, only to walk away from it for a mere pittance?

Where did any of this information come from? Was it the same source that placed Jacob Waltz in the back of Julia’s store? That had Christina Morrell interviewing Rhiney in 1933?

Who was Bertie Roberts? Did she even exist? Glover didn’t seem to think so. Corbin did.

Who was Margaret Roberts? Did she even exist? Corbin didn’t seem to think so. Glover did.

Who was the aunt that passed all this information along? Did she even exist? If so, did the information get modified after it left her hands?

How does Gideon O. Roberds (not Roberts) fit into all of this? He owned a lot just one block south and one block west of Julia’s in 1891 (his sister owned it for about 8 years before that). He was from Trinidad, in Las Animas County, Colorado, but spent every winter in Phoenix. He was a miner by trade. Dick Holmes’ lot was just south of his, but at a different time. Is it possible that Gideon O. Roberds and Gideon O. Roberts histories are getting confused, either mistakenly or intentionally? (For comparison, see Glover, page 199)

(BTW, Gideon Roberds lived until 1903).

Did Gideon Roberts even exist? If so, did he die in 1891? Who buried Gideon Roberts? Where was he buried? Where did the reference to the Pioneer Cemetery in Phoenix come from? When did that reference first come to light?

I guess my original question was one of frustration. I really didn’t expect any answers as there are none apparent. Even the questions above have no ready answers. It’s just another path of research that leaves me wondering whether there is any merit to some of the LDM backstory, and whether the Roberts family has been woven into the story through someone’s imagination.

Oh well.

Larry
__________________________________________________ _______

This was my eventual reply:
_______________________

Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:46 pm Larry,

I have no idea where you are going with this topic, but can assure you that Sarah (Bertie) Roberts did exist. There are plenty of documents to back up that statement, some of which I have copies of.

I would suggest you ask Dr. Glover why he used Margaret, instead of Sarah. I have, and received a reasonable answer. I will leave it to Thomas to speak for himself.

Azmula has written: "There is one individual who has all the Roberts Family History and can respond accurately."

I would be very surprised to see that "individual" respond to your attack.

If you have questions, why not email him directly rather than on a public forum? Trying to tie the entire Roberts family history into the Alkire story is, IMHO, short sighted and totally unfair.

While I could provide the documentation you seek, I will leave that to others. This will be my only post on this topic.

Joe Ribaudo
__________________________________________________ ___

It was, not my final post:
__________________________________________________ ___

Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:00 pm Larry.

"This will be my only post on this topic."

It would seem that another post is in order. That being the case, I would like to publicly apologize to you.

Kraig,

When you read this, as I know you will, please give me a call or send me an email. I need to talk to you.

Take care,

Joe
_______________________________________________

As you can see, a bit of time went by between those two posts. I did not come to that apology easily. A number of similar requests to Kraig have gone unanswered over the ensuing...........years. You will probably get the answers you are expecting to get.

Obviously I did not have the documentation I thought I did.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo


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"There is an ancient proverb that says a man can never forgive you for a wrong he has done you." From a wise friend.



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