Location of Julia Thomas Business 1891

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Shortcut?

Post by Ozarker »

(#26)

03-18-2009, 05:55 AM
Novice
Subject: Shortcut?

I know Larry would like to have everyone look over his shoulder and satisfy themselves regarding the location of Julia's business. I also realize his research is awfully intimidating.

I wanted to offer a shortcut that I used that got me 99% of the way there. The other records Larry references quickly put me at 100%.
Quote:

“All of these documents can be viewed on the Maricopa County Recorder's web site. After reaching the correct search menu, simply insert the book and page you are searching for and follow the links.”

Lease Book 2, Page 132 – This is Julia's lease and it names the Capital Building as the location of her business.

Lease Book 2, Page 121 – This lease provides the name of L. H. Goodrich who was the owner of the Capital Building.

Lease Book 1, Page 101 – This lease identifies the Capital Building owned by Goodrich. It also gives us the physical description. The building covered all of Lot 6 and the west 15 feet 2 inches of Lot 4 in Block 21.

The Sanborn Fire Maps, that Paul provided the link for, will give you the visual and orientation of Block 21, Lot 4 and Lot 6.

I suspect I have made Larry cringe with this "dumbing down" approach but it was this type of exercise that put me in the ballpark. Hopefully it might help someone else?

Garry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

County Records and Sanborn Maps

Post by Ozarker »

(#27)

03-18-2009, 06:43 AM
Ozarker
Subject: County Records and Sanborn Maps

Novice/All:

Garry has echoed a point that others have also made. This type of material and the number, complexity, and vagaries of the records can be intimidating for some, while others simply don't have the time to go through every record posted here to verify my conclusions. Another problem is the user interface at the county recorder web site. Combined with the indexing problems associated with the records, it can all be very discouraging, and I appreciate Garry passing along what worked for him.

Cubfan:

It would be nice to find updates or revisions to the Sanborn maps between November 1890 and June 1893 (as well as any other updates for other years). I suspect they'd lend alot to this and other efforts.

Between November 1890 and June 1893, the kitchen at the rear of the store Julia eventually leased went through an enlargement, nearly tripling its square footage. The problem is that because we only have these two versions of the map to work with (near that time window), we don't know whether the enlargement took place before, during, or after Julia's tenancy.

I was glad you asked and that Greg was able to check his files. Hopefully somone else has some additional experience with what's available and can chime in.

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#28)

3-18-2009, 09:38 AM
zentull

J W Dorris cash grocers at 1st and Washington. Dorris as mentioned earlier in this thread established his first store in 1888 and sold out to his brother in 1891. Dorris became partners in R W Drapers and later bought him out, establishing this store (which expanded and became one of the larger grocers on Washington) in 1892.

Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#29)

03-18-2009, 09:42 AM
zentull

I believe someone posted these photographs, but those posts are missing from when the site went down. Donofrios exterior and interior photographs at 25 east Washington.

Image


Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Dorris Cash Grocery and Street Addresses

Post by Ozarker »

(#30)

03-18-2009, 10:53 AM
Ozarker
Subject: Dorris Cash Grocery and Street Addresses

To add to Zentull's post, the JW Dorris store shown in the photo was known as the Dorris Cash Grocery, and was located in Block 20, opposite the old City Hall and very close to the former store of Julia and Emil Thomas. (It's not the Dorris confectionary store in Block 22 that had been proposed as the later location of Waltz's death).

How Dorris came to own the business in Block 22, across the street from Julia's actual location, is still not clear, but it appears that it had to be after January 1889, when the store is shown as being vacant on that version of the Sanborn map. George Loring owned the building even then, but I haven't been able to find a lease from him to Dorris. The first mention we have that a Loring lease actually existed is in the document from Dorris selling the business to Phiilips and Leggat on 25 March 1891.

I'm also glad that Zentull mentioned a street address, since that can be confusing. During the 1890s, Phoenix began implementing revisions to street addresses throughout the town. This was necessary because the same number often appeared more than once on any given street, and was probably confusing as the city continued to grow. The revisions to the addresses changed things to what we are used to today, with numbers increasing in sequence from Center Street (east-west) and Washington (north-south).

Different authors have given different addresses for Julia's old and new businesses over the years. In fact, I have yet to find any two addresses that match for any given store. This was probably due to the revisions in the street addresses, but also because there was some confusion about where Julia actually relocated.

This is a list of the stores during the years of interest, their actual addresses, and type of business as indicated on the various Sanborn maps:

January 1889
Old Store 9 (bread-confectionery)
New Store 14 (restaurant)
Loring (owner) 33 (vacant)

November 1890
Old Store 9 (bakery-confectionery)
New Store 14 (restaurant)
Dorris Confec. 33 (confectionery)

June 1893
Old Store address not shown, between 130 and 136 (millinery)
New Store 26 (restaurant)
Phillips-Leggat 23 (confectionery)
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#31)

03-18-2009, 12:07 PM
Roger
Subject: Rhinehart Petrasch's Info on Julia's Store

Helen Corbin includes in her book, The Bible, on Pages 138 - 140, a narrative that Rhiney Petrasch had WRITTEN DOWN and TOLD to Bertie Roberts. Here are some details pertaining to Julia's store and where Waltz resided in those final months from Page 139 (parenthesis are added by me) just after Rhiney and Albert Schafer got him back in town from the 1891 flood:

"....When he (Waltz) recovered his senses (at the Doctor's place) we took him over to Julia's house on Jackson Street and put him up in the sun porch off the kitchen (all the sleeping rooms were being used at the time). Old Waltz raised a fit the whole time he was there and Julia moved her bakery business from across the plaza and moved in next to Archer's on the south side of Washington Street. Julia put Waltz up in a little storage room in back of that bakery. All's he had in there was a pallet for a bed and a chair and some shelfs but he quit fittin and fussin all the time and finally seemed satisfied."

Helen also writes the following information of what happened after Waltz died on Page 137 - 138 which came from the Roberts family history:

"Walt's body was taken to Julia's home to be prepared for burial, a common practice in that era. Several friends came by that day to pay their respects only to learn that Jacob Waltz had already been taken to the cemetary and buried."

Some conclusions from this detail:

1. Waltz was at Julia's HOME for awhile after he survived the flood and was take to her home AFTER he died for burial prep. Note the wording in the Phoenix Daily Herald Oct 26, 1891, newspaper articles on Page 141:

"Jacob Waltz, aged 81 years, died at 6 a.m. Sunday, October 25, 1891, and was buried at 10 o'clock this morning, from the residence of Mrs J.E. Thomas......."

Note the word "from" in the news article - it is consistent with him being buried from that residence as Rhiney wrote and does not necessarily imply that Waltz was living there when he died.

I think that Waltz having been at Julia's residence at the first of his illiness and being buried from her residence has created a lot of the confusion about Waltz living at her home and not the back of her store. Since Rhiney worked at the store then and help care for Waltz, I would give significant creedence to his version of happened as he wrote it down.

2. Rhiney states that Julia's new store was on the SOUTH side of Washington Street and next to a business run by Archer. Again, since Rhiney worked in the store, I would believe he would know the difference between the South vs North side of the street. Does someone know where the Archer store was located? That might validate Rhiney's version even further. It could be possible that Julia executed a lease for the North side and backed out of that and then took a location on the South side and that record has not surfaced yet.

Cubfan,

I caught the information in Slim Kite's taped interview also about Dick Holmes wife saying that she lived just across the fence to the adjoining property of Julia Thomas where Waltz was living. Slim said Mrs. Holmes said Julia came out and yelled for Dick to come over as Jake was dying. The problem with this story is that Dick Holmes lived acorss the street and a half a block West of where Julia lived - they certainly did not share a fence. Suspect this story is bogus.

My general take on all this is that Waltz stayed in the storeroom behind Julia's store, died there, was taken to Julia's home for burial prep, and then buried a few hours later.

The one other item of note: Rhiney said on Page 139 that he removed two cans of gold from beneath Waltz's hearthstone at his ruined adobe home and that each can weighed 30 - 40 lbs. Assume that each can weighted 35 lbs and that the cobbed gold ore in the cans was 80% pure would give 28 lbs of pure gold in each can. 28 lbs is 34 troy lbs or 408 troy ounces. At $35/oz, each can was worth $14,280 and both cans were worth $28,560. We know from records that Dick Holmes got $4,800 when he cashed in some gold shortly after Waltz passed away. These figures would lead one to believe he still had $23,760 in his possession after that sale which funded him a very good lifestyle for a number of years to come. Maybe Dick Holmes did not find the Lost Dutchman, but he reaped a very good reward from the dead Dutchman

Waltz's 408 troy ounces of gold would be worth $380,664 at today's gold price of $933/oz. And to think, Waltz said the big cache of gold that he and Wieser had made was still hidden in the Superstitions. Have to wonder how much a big cache would be worth today based on what old Jake had under his bed.

Roger
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Bertie Roberts.....

Post by Ozarker »

(#32)

03-18-2009, 01:03 PM
Joe_Ribaudo
Subject: Bertie Roberts......

Roger,

Thanks for that refresher course. Anything older than ten minutes ago is lost to my memory banks.

The one thing I am sure of, is that Bertie Roberts is as good as it gets. Was there a date for that interview? You would think the discussion would have triggered my memory about her interview.

I am not sure gold was $35 an oz. in 1891.

Thanks again,

Joe
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#33)

03-18-2009, 01:26 PM
zentull

Roger posted:
“Helen also writes the following information of what happened after Waltz died on Page 137 - 138 which came from the Roberts family history:

Walt's body was taken to Julia's home to be prepared for burial, a common practice in that era. Several friends came by that day to pay their respects only to learn that Jacob Waltz had already been taken to the cemetary and buried. ”

Only problem is did they pick up the morning paper Monday when the Obit was posted and find he was already buried before 10 AM Monday morning? If you take the Petrasch story at face value there are some time issues for everything to happen as it did. 3/4 of the stories have Petrasch at Waltz's bedside in one form or another(including early Holmes accounts) and the other side is Rhiney being drunk on the boardwalk

Another annoying thing is 1/2 the time Herman and Rhiney push Waltz and the other 1/2 the time they are on the Waltzer kick.

The documentation presented in this thread seems to lean differently with what has been presented in the past and I believe it is just as valid as what we have read before.
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#34)

03-18-2009, 01:28 PM
zentull

Joe,

1933 at Riverside park
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#35)

03-18-2009, 02:23 PM
Ozarker
Subject: 1891

Roger:

My review of the county records revealed nobody named Archer as either a lessor or lessee for any business located on Washington Street between Cortes (1st Avenue) and Maricopa (2nd Street). This encompassed the blocks on both sides of Washington for a three-block stretch, with the location of Julia's business almost dead center.

An index search of all official county records (deeds, miscellaneous, brand books, mining records, etc.) results in hits for only one couple named Archer that owned Lot 18 in Block 24 from about 1888 to 1890, but there are no other Archers in that time frame. The index search at the county web site has its problems, and this doesn't mean that there weren't more Archers, just that they don't appear to be indexed.

A search of the 1892 combined business and city directory reveals a listing for "RH Archer, saloonkeeper, res Maricopa cor Jefferson". A review of the plat map of Phoenix (Hancock Survey) reveals that at the corner of Maricopa and Jefferson is located Lot 18 Block 24, so that corresponds to the deed record mentioned above. The problem is that the directory does not identify which saloon Archer was working in.

According to the November 1890 Sanborn map, there was only one saloon on the south side of Washington in Block 22, and it was located immediately next door to the Dorris Confectionary (later sold to Phillips-Leggat, who also operated it as a confectionary). This saloon was run by MJ McKelligon. On the north side of Washington, in Block 21 where I believe Julia actually located, there were three saloons, including the one that was located right next door to her and called "The Capitol Saloon". It was run by Pierce W. Butler and Sarah Pimm.

A review of the 1893 Sanborn map shows that one additional saloon had opened on the north side of the street in Block 21, in the former grocery store operated by Farley and Gant (five stores to the west from Julia). No additional saloons were opened on the south side of the street in Block 22.

I asked Greg Davis to send me transcripts of the following articles which shed some light on whether Julia actually ever moved in, or if she backed out of the lease that's been discussed. The newspaper accounts are from May 1891 and complement the lease records that have already been presented:

Phoenix Daily Herald (28 May 1891) Page 3 Column 2

"The soda water, fruit and confectionary business built up within the past few years by Mrs. J.E. Thomas has become so extensive, that her present quarters proved altogether inadequate. The large and commodious rooms between Jacobs & Co. and The Capitol, on Washington street have therefore been leased. Everything in the way of refreshments, mineral waters, ice cream, oranges, lemons, fruits and candies of all descriptions will be found here. Cool alcoves and prompt attention are provided for all who seek rest and recuperation in this most inviting retreat."


Arizona Daily Gazette (29 May 1891) Page 4 Column 2

"Thomas' ice cream parlor was moved yesterday from the old stand opposite the city hall to the room recently occupied by Coleman's saloon."


Jacobs and Co. was located on the north side of Washington in Block 21, two doors to the west of the store that Julia signed the lease for, and "The Capitol" was the Pierce Butler and Sarah Pimm saloon, immediately next door to Julia on the east. The Jacobs and Co. lease that was in effect when Julia leased the store can be found in (Lease Book 2 Page 110). The Capitol Saloon lease of Butler and Pimm can be found in (Lease Book 1 Page 398). The fact that Julia was leasing the former Coleman saloon is mentioned in her lease (Lease Book 2 Page 132). And finally, Coleman's lease, which shows that the saloon was in the Capitol Building, is in (Lease Book 2 Page 112).


Joe:

Helen's paragraph on page 138, immediately preceding the written account attributed to Rhiney, is as follows:

"Rheinhart Petrasch relates the story of retrieving some of Waltz's property after the flood in 1891. The account, which follows, was written down by Rheinhart and told to Bertie Roberts and Christine (Cavaness) Morrell at the Pioneer Days Celebration held in Phoenix Riverside Park in 1933."

When I read that passage, I see that it can be taken one of two ways:

1) It was written down by Rhiney, who then told the story, or
2) It was written down by Rhiney, then told by somebody, but not necessarily Rhiney.

I'm keeping my mind open to either possibility.

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Ganz and the Cotten Block

Post by Ozarker »

(#36)

03-18-2009, 02:49 PM
Ozarker
Subject: Ganz and the Cotten Block

The 1933 account by Rhiney, cited by Roger in his previous post, also contains the following passage on page 140:

"Waltz told me to break the gold out of the rock best I could and sell it at Ganz's store across from the cotton [sic] block there."

The Cotten Block is referring to the Cotten Building (buildings were also called blocks then, as evidenced in the county records and on the Sanborn maps). The building was located in Block 22 on the southeast corner of Center and Washington. During my records review, I paid particular attention to locating Ganz's store (probably referring to Emil Ganz), keeping my eye out for records of him owning or operating any stores in Blocks 21, 22, or 77; the three blocks that one could possibly have been located based on the 1933 account. To make a long story short, I could find no records of a Ganz-owned or -operated business in those three blocks in 1891, or for the period 1882 to 1900 for that matter.

Again, there are problems with the records, but for that stretch of time, I would have thought that at lease one record would show up?

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

1891 Gold Prices

Post by Ozarker »

(#37)

03-18-2009, 03:26 PM
Roger
Subject: 1891 Gold Prices

Joe,

You are correct - the price of gold for the year of 1891 was $20.67. That would make the total gold value from Waltz at $8,433 which would leave Dick Holmes with $3,633 in gold after selling $4,800 of it. Still not a bad sum for the 1891 era.

Here is the web site for gold pricing history back to 1793:

http://goldinfo.net/yearly.html

Thanks for the catch.

Roger
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Ganz

Post by Ozarker »

(# Thirty-eight)

03-18-2009, 03:55 PM
dutchman dave
Subject: Ganz

Dont know where this might fit in but found this about emil ganz on a internet sight about the ganz family of phoenix.
“Emil Ganz was born in 1838 in the small town of Walldorf, Germany. Pry believes he immigrated to the United States in 1858 or 1859 and spent time in New York or Philadelphia.

By the summer of 1860, bachelor Ganz was living in Cedartown, Ga., northwest of Atlanta, working as a tailor. When the civil war broke out, he enlisted in the Confederate Army and served in its infantry until the summer of 1864 when he was captured and sent to the notorious prison camp in Elmira, N.Y.

Ganz opened a saloon in Prescott. Not long after, Elizabeth divorced Ganz, charging him with abuse. But Pry says that divorce then required such charges, and there is no evidence Ganz was actually an abusive husband.

Ganz opened a different saloon, the Capital, which had not only a bar but rooms to rent upstairs. He dabbled in gold and silver mining.

In 1879, the divorced Ganz moved to Phoenix, the business climate in Prescott failing to live up to his expectations. Phoenix was being hyped as an up-and-coming community.

Staked by a Prescott banker, Ganz opened the Bank Exchange Hotel in Phoenix in April of 1879, the biggest and fanciest hotel in town - out of three. The brick building was located on Washington Street between First and Second streets.

"It was an instant success," Pry says. "It becomes the hotel," with a bar and restaurant and prominent advertising in the Phoenix Herald.

In 1882, Ganz returned briefly to Kansas City and married Bertha Angleman, a Jewish woman selected by his cousins.

Three years later, Ganz, now a prominent citizen and business leader, was asked to run for mayor and won his first one-year term.

"Jews played a major role in business," he says. Most stores were run by Jews, and Jews were civic minded, though holding public office was still a new experience. Morris Goldwater, Barry Goldwater's uncle, was mayor of Prescott in 1879, and a Jew was elected mayor of Tucson in 1882.

Ganz was active in the Masons, which helped him integrate into society. The Masons welcomed Jews, Pry says.

Ganz's first mayoral term was uneventful, though he earned a reputation for being an efficient administrator. The mayor's primary responsibility was maintaining the city's streets - cleaning up after horses and keeping irrigation ditches free of debris.

That summer, the Bank Exchange Hotel burned to the ground when fire wiped out an entire block. Ganz built an office building on the site and became a landlord.

Re-elected mayor in 1886, Ganz found his second term plagued by controversy. City leaders wanted to build a fire station but argued over its location. When Ganz favored one site, he was accused of promoting a location close to his own businesses. Offended by suggestions of conflicted interests, he abruptly quit the job and took an assignment as member of an oversight board for the state's insane asylum, which would eventually evolve into the Arizona State Hospital.

A year later he opened a liquor business on Washington Street, which he maintained until 1895.

Emil and Bertha had their first child in 1884, when Sylvan Cleveland Ganz was born and named for then-president Grover Cleveland. They had three more children: Helen, who died in 1890 of diphthera; Julien, born in 1893; and Aileen, born in 1896.

Ganz went into the insurance business and became president of the National Bank of Arizona, largest in the territory. There was a strong Jewish presence in the bank, Pry says, further enhancing the prominence of Jews in Phoenix.

Over the years, the Ganz family would live in several homes in Phoenix: Adams and 14th streets, Monroe Street between Fourth and Fifth avenues and at 1324 N. Central Ave., near Willetta Street.

In 1899, Ganz was elected to his third term as mayor. Controversy erupted once again when council members proposed that the city take control of a private company providing water rights. Ganz objected, reluctant to support government take-over of a business. Critics charged he was protecting friends who had investments in the water company.

This time, Ganz did not walk off the job and eventually supported the take-over.

When Ganz had first become mayor, Phoenix covered about 1.3 square miles. By his third term, it had doubled. In 1901, President William McKinley would visit the town, just months before his assassination in Buffalo, N.Y.

After Bertha Ganz died in 1905, Ganz married again, this time a younger woman who would bear him a child, Frances, when Ganz was 70.

Ganz retired from the bank in 1920 and died two years later in his summer residence in San Diego. His death warranted a front-page obituary in the Arizona Republican and services at the Shrine Auditorium. He is buried in Greenwood Cemetery.”
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

The Facts

Post by Ozarker »

(#39)

03-19-2009, 08:59 AM
Ozarker
Subject: The Facts

dutchman dave:

Thanks for the Emil Ganz history. It sounds like Ganz led an interesting life, both in and out of Phoenix.

All:

It was pointed out to me that I made an error in post Number 14. In the text of my post, I should have stated that the map was of Block 20 (not Block 21). Sorry for the slip.

[Note: This has been corrected]

Also, I know that the information laid out in my previous posts has been pretty dry, and is not everybody's "cup of tea". I apologize for that, but felt it was necessary to lay out the paper trail found in my research. I hope to get into territory that people feel more comfortable with, and are willing to contribute to.

As for the business with Ganz, Archer, and the location of Julia's store.

The lease records help to confirm the information contained in dutchman dave's post. Ganz did have property between First and Second Streets (Montezuma and Maricopa Streets) which he both operated himself and leased out to others. This property was in Block 20, opposite the old city hall and near the location of the old Thomas confectionary. The Capitol Saloon associated with Ganz appears to have been located in Prescott, and was not the one in Phoenix run by Pierce Butler and Sarah Pimm.

The point is that no record could be found to indicate Ganz having a store "across from the cotton block there" as given in the account attributed to Rhiney. Nor was there an Archer that ran a business either next door to the Phillips Leggat Confectionary in Block 22, which we have been led to believe was Julia's new store, or next to the actual location of Julia's store, located on the north side of Washington in Block 21. There was a saloon keeper named Archer in the 1892 Phoenix directory, and he may have tended bar in one of the Washington Street saloons, but we have no firm evidence that was the case. Finally, an analysis of the 1890 and 1893 Sanborn maps shows that there was no storeroom in the rear of the store that Julia leased, another key point contained in the account attributed to Rhiney. In short, the account simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

The lease records were legally binding documents that were signed by both parties to the agreements, and the notary public, and the county recorder. Provenance doesn't get much stronger than that. The records show that Julia leased the former James Coleman saloon which was located in the Capitol Building on the north side of Washington, and newspaper accounts confirm what is shown in the records. There was no back storeroom to place Waltz in; either before, during, or immediately after Julia's tenancy.

As Roger pointed out, surely Rhiney knew the difference between north and south. And surely he would [have] known the location of Julia's store and its physical arrangement. You would think that he'd also know the location of neighboring business owners, although of this I'm less sure.

All of this leads me to believe that the 1933 account was [not given] by Rhiney. It may have been given as authentic and in good faith, and may have been passed along as such, but it simply does not mesh with what we know to be true concerning the location of Julia's store.

It appears that many have accepted the account attributed to Rhiney as authentic and that the information in the account is pretty much the way it happened. It's also been pointed out to me that there are other accounts that seem to back it up. However, similar to the account attributed to Rhiney, the accounts simply don't stand up to what is shown in the records.

It's important to look at these other accounts in a similar fashion in order to get closer to the actual sequence of events in the last months of Jacob Waltz's life. I'll try to avoid getting into the format of my previous posts (laying out book and page numbers) but will be glad to pass those along to anybody that needs the information for their own effort.

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Location of Julia's Stores

Post by Ozarker »

(#40)

03-19-2009, 09:15 AM
Roger
Subject: Location of Julia's Stores

Larry,

The detailed data you posted is probably a little "dry" as you said, but such is what one has to do a lot of in researching the LDM and early Phoenix history. Searching old records is not like reading adventure books - tons of digging through info unrelated to the topic of interest to find a few related facts on the topic of interest and then a VERY FEW real gems are found that make the heart pump a little faster

I'm sure Greg is capturing the results of all the research posted on the Forum for the archives so the work will live on for generations to come.

Larry - a job well done

Roger
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#41)

03-19-2009, 12:05 PM
Gregory E. Davis

Yes Roger, I am following this thread very close and copies are being added to the Thomas file. One cannot always rely on the index to these records. Some are missed and it requires one to go through the original record books. I have found a number of cases where documents were not properly indexed. Maybe someday the officials will correct these problems but I am not holding my breath. Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#42)

03-19-2009, 01:27 PM
zentull

I am sure Larry will get around to the other stores and other notables on the North side of Washington as time goes, but this was one of those weird incidental things that always creeps up on you.

Image


In 1898 George Matthew Roberts conveyed lot 11 block 20 to Ezra Thayer, which is likely the lot pictured to the left in the picture which is around 1898-1900. This is between first and second streets and easily identifiable today in block 20. Julias first store was to the right of this years earlier. This lot or transaction emanated from George R Roberts will and is very likely the actual site of his saloon rather than the block 21 site in Corbins book. There is a bit of confusion because Matt Cavaness and Peeples convey property to Goldberg Bros. in 1893 on what is listed as Lot 11 block 20. They owned this lot from 1873 forward it appears. Goldbergs does show up on block 21 however in later photographs in the approximate spot where that lot may have originally been.

While following up Thayer (something seemed familiar along the Albert and Julia stuff with that name) I found his obit:
Wickenburg Sun, Wickenburg, AZ
June 4, 1937, p. 1

EZRA W. THAYER
PASSES AWAY

Former Operator of Monte Cristo Mine, Well
Known in Arizona Mining Circles, is Called Thursday.

Private funeral services for Ezra W. Thayer, 77 years old, widely known Arizona mining man and one of the state's pioneer developers, who died early yesterday morning at his home at 2242 West Adams street, were held at 10 a. m. yesterday from Memory chapel of A. L. Moore & Sons.
Burial will follow in Greenwood Memorial park.

Mr. Thayer was born in Pittsfield, Mass., October 5, 1849. When a young man he went to Utah and from there came to Phoenix in 1882, where he had resided since.

During his 66 years residence here Mr. Thayer had engaged in various mining ventures throughout the state and did much to promote the development of Maricopa county's mineral resources.

He always contended that the surface had hardly been scratched in the county, and that development would reveal untold mineral wealth.

Starting as a clerk in a local hardware store, Mr. Thayer soon opened a store of his own, which he operated until 1929, continuing meanwhile to interest himself in mining projects.

Among the major properties which he had owned and operated was the Monte Christo mine, near Wickenburg, which for some time ranked as one of the state's leading producers.

In addition to his mining and business interests, Mr. Thayer was active in many community development movements. He also owned considerable property in the city.

He was an active member of the Phoenix chamber of Commerce and for many years was affiliated with all local Masonic bodies.

Surviving are his wife, a daughter Priscilla and two sons, Nathan B. Thayer of Phoenix, and Ezra W, Thayer, Jr. of Los Angeles

I took Greg and Randy over to the Monte Christo mine after we spent the morning at Alberts gravesite and claims for some extra fun. One of those unusual coincidences that always seem to pop up.
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Julia's Old Store

Post by Ozarker »

(#43)

03-19-2009, 02:06 PM
Ozarker
Subject: Julia's Old Store

Wayne:

Thanks for the Thayer history and the photo. It's too bad the recessed part of the building is in shadow (the area behind the white horse's head), as that is about where Julia and Emil's old store would have been located. If the date range you mention is in the ballpark, it may have been a liquor store by this point, or shortly thereafter (1901 Sanborn map). Alexander Steinegger still owned the lot and building, and had leased it out to John Baggiore and Prosper Bardone for three years beginning in January 1897 (Lease Book 2 Page 615).

All:

Zentull made a good point about the location of the George Roberts saloon (see notation on the map in Helen Corbin's book, page 132). The saloon identified as George Robert's on the map was actually the Capitol Saloon run by Pierce Butler and Sarah Pimm (see previous posts concerning the history of the Capitol Building).

As for identifying all the tenants of the various stores around Julia's, I believe that's a worthwhile idea and am trying to decide the best way to do that.

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Block 21 Occupants in 1891

Post by Ozarker »

(#44)

03-19-2009, 08:12 PM
Ozarker
Subject: Block 21 Occupants in 1891

Hello All:

This is an excerpt of the November 1890 Sanborn Map, enlarged to show the detail in Block 21 and annotated to show the occupants of the stores at the time of Julia's tenancy.

Only the occupants of the stores facing Washington Street are shown.

Also, only the ground floor occupants of the two-story buildings are shown. The upper stories of these buildings were office space occupied by various professionals such as lawyers, doctors, and real estate agents.

Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Block 22 Occupants in 1891

Post by Ozarker »

(#45)

03-19-2009, 08:14 PM
Ozarker
Subject: Block 22 Occupants in 1891

Hello All:

This is an excerpt of the November 1890 Sanborn Map, enlarged to show the detail in Block 22 and annotated to show the occupants of the stores at the time of Julia's tenancy.

As in my previous post, only the occupants of the stores on the ground floor and facing Washington Street are shown. The upper stories of these buildings were also office space occupied by professionals.

Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Ozarker »

(#46)

03-19-2009, 09:23 PM
Gregory E. Davis

Hello Larry: Would it be possible for you to do another Sanborn Map listing the identification of the business for block 20 showing the people on Washington St. who surrounded the bakery run by Emil and Julia? Cordially, Gregory E. Davis
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Block 20 Occupants in 1891

Post by Ozarker »

(#47)

03-20-2009, 06:34 AM
Ozarker
Subject: Block 20 Occupants in 1891

Hello All:

This is an excerpt of the November 1890 Sanborn Map, enlarged to show the detail in Block 20 and annotated to show occupants of the ground floor stores facing Washington Street in 1891.

Across the street (south side of Washington) was the plaza where the old city hall was located. There were no businesses located there.

Block 20 was undergoing a lot of construction and remodeling of stores as the downtown area was being improved and built out from Center Avenue. In particular the buildings on the corners (highlighted in red) were undergoing significant changes. A comparison to the June 1893 Sanborn map will give you an idea of the changes that took place, and in some cases is more accurate regarding the type of store being operated by the occupants shown below.

The stores that have no identified occupants may have been operated by the building owners themselves (owners are shown in parentheses), hence there was no lease to be found in the records. Another possibility is that the stores were leased but the record was never filed, or the leases are to be found in the missing pages of the lease records. A visit to the county recorder's office is planned, and any information that comes to light will be provided.

Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Pierce Butler and Sarah Pimm

Post by Ozarker »

(# Forty-eight)

03-20-2009, 07:30 AM
Ozarker
Subject: Pierce Butler and Sarah Pimm

Hello All:

For the two-year period of 1888 to 1890, Pierce "Ben" Butler had a partner in the saloon business named Sarah Pimm. Sarah only appeared on one lease for the saloon (January 1888 to January 1890), and it's possible that she wasn't a long term partner with Butler.

Sarah was married to William Pimm, and in February 1887 she filed a record with the county recorder which indicated she was going into the saloon and cigar business with her own individual assets, and would be solely responsible for any contracts she entered into (Notice of Sole Tradership, Miscellaneous Book 3 Page 241).

My guess is that Sarah went into business with Butler soon after filing this document, and was then included on the next lease for the saloon (from Lofus Goodrich) when it came up for renewal. The only record found for Sarah after this was from May 1893, when she and her husband sold their property in Phoenix to Charles Rigden (Deed Book 34 Page 41).

The saloon lease for the next two-year period (January 1890 to January 1892) was not found in the county records, so it is not clear whether Sarah was still in business with Butler. We know that Pierce Butler was still the proprietor of the saloon because of the sublease executed by him to Julia Thomas in June 1891. It's interesting to note that Julia was required to pay her monthly rent of $75 to Butler at the saloon, and that Butler wasn't trying to make a profit off of Julia, as this was the same monthly rent he was required to pay on the store to Goodrich.

Larry
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Alkire Dry Goods and Clothing Company

Post by Ozarker »

(#49)

03-22-2009, 08:23 AM
Ozarker
Subject: Alkire Dry Goods and Clothing Company

There are various accounts indicating that Frank Alkire was witness to the events at Julia's store the evening before Jacob Waltz's death. One version of the account relates that Frank Alkire and Dick Holmes were employed at George Alkire's grocery across the street from Julia's store, giving them front row seats for the spectacle.

The map in Corbin (page 132) indicates that the Alkire Grocery was located on the north side of Washington in Block 21. However, this particular store was actually occupied and being run as a grocery by the firm of Farley and Gant, who had been in the location since November 1886.

Successive leases and a mention in the lease for the neighboring store confirms that the Farley and Gant Grocery was still in operation on 18 September 1891 (Lease Book 2 Page 139). Four months later, after Jacob Waltz died, Farley and Gant gave up their lease on the store and a new lease was issued to Frank Luke, commencing in March 1892, who converted it into a saloon and gambling hall (Lease Book 2 Page 168).

The Alkires did establish a business across the street from Julia's store (a detail which the accounts inadvertently got correct) but it wasn't until 7 January 1893, over a year after Jacob Waltz died, and 6 months after Julia had sold her business to Schooler and Wilson.

The Alkire Dry Goods and Clothing Company (Frank T Alkire, Secretary) was established in the Cotten Building on the south side of Washington after assuming the existing lease on the dry goods store of Dillon and Kenealy (Lease Book 2 Page 230). Dillon and Kenealy had been in the store since the Cotten Building was erected in about 1889 (and on the neighboring lot for years before that) and it appears that the Alkire store was also successful in this location. The Alkire lease was later renewed and they remained in this location for several years, eventually expanding into the space behind the bank so that they also had frontage on Center Street. It appears that the business continued to expand, eventually leasing and moving to the lot next door in January 1899.

This is an excerpt of the June 1893 Sanborn map, enlarged and annotated to show the relative locations of Julia's former business, which she sold to Schooler and Wilson in July 1892 (Arizona Daily Gazette, 10 Jul 1892), and the Alkire Dry Goods and Clothing Company, established 7 January 1893.

Image
Ozarker
Part Timer
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:12 pm

Alkire.....

Post by Ozarker »

(#50)

03-22-2009, 11:09 AM
Joe_Ribaudo
Subject: Alkire.....

Larry,

Frank, and Asenath, as far as I know, were on their ranch until 1903.

Frank's first attempt at ranching was in the Tonto Basin, where he built a cabin which was later acquired by Zane Gray as a wilderness home. The high cost of stocking a ranch in that country forced Frank to relocate to New River. The Triangle Bar was already in business and Alkire purchased it.

While in San Diego, Calif. for his health/vacation, Frank met Asenath Phelps and they were married on April 9, 1889. Frank brought her to the ranch and built a home for her. After their second child was born, they moved into town and Frank and his brother ran a mercantile business for 11 years.

For the record, George Copes Alkire was that second child. He was born May 20, 1903.

A partial source is: A copy of Frank's handwritten manuscript "The Little Lady of the Triangle Bar". Nowhere in that manuscript is Jacob Waltz, or Julia Thomas mentioned. There are other writings of Alkire, that I have not viewed, which may touch on the story of Waltz's death. In time, I will look at them all. Frank gave this particular manuscript to the museum in Phoenix in 1942.

It would be a fluke, IMHO, if Frank was in town the day that Waltz died. The only thing that would change my mind, would be to see it in Frank's own hand. By the time that Frank Alkire started writing his history, Waltz was a famous person in Phoenix. If Alkire had any connection with those events, I can't imagine that he would not write about it.

Other sources are all over the place.

You have done some interesting and informative research. Thanks for sharing it.

Take care,

Joe
Post Reply