LDM Documents on the Internet

Discuss information about the Lost Dutchman Mine
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LDM Documents on the Internet

Post by novice »

I have a test link that I’m working on. It presently involves newspaper articles regarding the Adolph Ruth Disappearance. The articles have been transcribed and are in PDF format, so you need Adobe Reader on your computer to open them.

At the present the page is a part of my personal home page. I can take the link down if someone sees problems. I don’t know where I’m going with this, if anywhere. I was hoping to create a venue to share some documents that are not readily available for all Dutch Hunters. If a couple of you guys would be so kind as to follow the link and give me some feedback, I would appreciate it. Does it open, are the links working, etc? Heck, I might even consider suggestions.

Randy, Did you really mean it when you said you need to read some of the newpaper articles about Ruth? :D

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com ... tchman.htm

Thanks in Advance,

Garry
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Kudos.......

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Garry,

Kudos my friend.

Other than holding those yellowed newspaper articles in your hand, your site is as good as it gets. Too many people want to hold the hard won information they have gathered in some secret place, to be viewed only by themselves. I am reminded of stolen paintings/artifacts, paid for and withheld from view.......save only for one. :roll:

Like people, such as: Steve Creager, Matthew Roberts, Thomas Glover, Tom Kollenborn, Helen Corbin and Greg Davis, you have risen above the intellectual misers and become......... A trusted source.

Very, very nice work and the site works perfectly. Thanks for sharing it.

Take care,

Joe
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Post by djui5 »

Novice,
Thank you Sir!!! I'm gonna read some and report back later. Have some free time this evening since someone decided to reschedule a meeting :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Randy Wright
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"I don't care if it has electric windows. I don't care if the door gaps are straight, but when the driver steps on the gas I want him to piss his pants."
Enzo Ferrari
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Story Lines......

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Garry,

Interesting to see where the newspaper accounts and the stories that have been accepted as fact for many years now, part company.

Thanks again,

Joe
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Adolph Ruth's trail to Willow Springs

Post by novice »

I plan to add a few more articles to the miscellaneous file over the next couple of days. One involving the P.C. Bicknell article that I found interesting. Erwin Ruth must have brought a copy of the article when he came to Arizona for the search.

One thing that you will find, if you read the articles closely, are references to how Adolph entered the mountains. Also in Erwin's manuscript. It would be interesting to gather the articles together and keep score? Some of the references are in the articles I will be adding.

Garry
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Ruth's Copy of Bicknell's Article

Post by novice »

Joe Ribaudo wrote; “Interesting to see where the newspaper accounts and the stories that have been accepted as fact for many years now, part company.”

Jeff Adams and Jim Bark do indeed paint a far different picture of one incident, than that reflected in the newspapers.

One of the cornerstones of the Ruth story is the hand written mine location clue, found when the body was recovered. It lies within an imaginary circle……Veni, Vidi, Vici ....about 200 feet across from cave.

There were a few things from the newspapers that gave me pause.

Even things as detailed as Ruth’s Woodmen of America Card, newspaper clippings, and a phone number of a fellow in Utah are all listed as being found with the body, there is no mention of a handwritten note containing the clues from the P. C. Bicknell story.

We do know, from the Prescott Evening Courier of July 15, 1931, (You can read the article :) ) that Erwin brought the story to Arizona. The article by Ralph O. Brown, Associated Press Correspondent, states that the particular “Lost Dutchman” legend, that Ruth followed, was in a scrap book found by his son, Erwin. The newspaper quotes excerpts from the Bicknell article almost verbatim, so there is no doubt that Erwin had the article. Since this was an AP article, it probably had wide distribution.

From the accounts of Ruth’s body discovery, we are left to wonder what happened to the hand written note or was that just a part of the story that used the Ralph Brown article, and was later added to the story.

Although the Adams and Bark accounts indicate some shady activity (in my eyes), in this case, they seem to fill in the blanks.

According to the newspapers, the final search party for Ruth’s body consisted of five members, Jeff Adams, deputy sheriff of Maricopa county and Ace Gardner, deputy sheriff of Pinal county along with Tex Barkley, Hosie Cline and Gabriel Robles. The party was led by Adams and they entered the Superstitions Tuesday, January 5, 1932.

Regarding the discovery of the body from the January 8, 1932, Friday Evening, Phoenix Gazette newspaper.

“The discovery was made this morning [Friday] shortly after the fourth day of the painstaking hunt began. The searchers immediately returned to their First Water ranch base camp and Deputy Adams went on to the Cavanaugh service station, near Apache Junction, to telephone his report to Sheriff McFadden.”

I always had a problem with a portion of the Jeff Adams letter to Senator Carl Hayden who was questioning the findings of accidental death. (Corbin, Page 308 and 309) Adams wrote; “After finding and assembling these bones we followed the direction given to reach the alleged Lost Dutchman mine. This trip took us two days of very hard labor and following these directions we came to the place pointed out in the instructions and found no evidence of any human being ever having been there at any time in the past.”

This story was quite different than that reported in the newspaper. Adams and party had discovered the body on Tuesday or Wednesday and instead of returning to First Water and getting in touch with their bosses, had embarked on a two day search for the Lost Dutchman mine.

Jim Bark seems to confirm Adam’s story. He writes in his notes; “After finding this note, the hunting party of five went into a huddle and then asked Barkley if he knew of such a cave. Tex replied that he knew of a cave up there. Whether it was the right one or not he could not say, so they gathered up the bones and belongings of Ruth and took them to camp. Each got an empty grain sack and returned to explore the cave, and incidentally to get a sack of gold ore or nuggets whichever it might be. Tex led them to a cave, and it certainly was a rough trip, but they found no mine or gold.”

Bark even describes where the note was found; “When they found the body of Ruth they also found a blank check book. In the flap, neatly folded and tucked therein was a leaf from the note book belonging to Ruth.” And to add credibility to Bark’s story he relates that he has a photo static copy of the note. I believe that Gregory Davis may have a copy of that photo static copy in his collection.

I believe this is the scenario I will stick with until someone proves it incorrect. (It helps the timeline :) )

Of course this raises other questions.

Did this party of five catch gold fever with the discovery of the note and strike off on their own to find the Lost Dutchman?

The next day when Sheriff McFadden and E. D. Newcomer show up, had the five already gathered the bones and belongings and taken them to their camp as Bark states. Did everyone then return to the site with the remains in tow and stage a few photos for Newcomer?

Where would their logical camp site have been? Why did it take two days to reach the cave? Of the five people involved, who kept the note? Bark states that the note was sent to Washington to the Ruth family and they identified the handwriting as being that of Adolph. This would indicate it was not returned to the family with Adolph’s remains and his other personal items but someone in Arizona had kept the note.

If you are a real skeptic, was the site shown McFadden and Newcomer the actual discovery site? They apparently found the body fairly quick, but then in an effort to explain the four day search, they established the discovery site as more remote than it actually was?

Garry
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Post by zentull »

Nice job Garry. A lot of people will be thankful for the link to follow along and see the news articles first hand.
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Garry

Post by lazarus »

Garry,
keep up the excellent work. That's some great stuff you've got there.

Brad
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Following The Directions......

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Garry,

I believe the directions to the mine, consisted of the P.C. Bicknell quotation. I assume it took two days to reach the cave, because that's how far Tex wanted to lead the searchers away from Ruth's true destination.

Rather than making more out of the directions than is written in them, you simply come over the main mountain/"lofty ridge", drop into West Boulder and take the "tributary canyon" that runs south east just below Willow Spring.

You will find an old mine that is sealed for your efforts. It may very well have been a cave......to begin with. That may have been where Ruth wanted to be all along.

Another interesting fact, is the maps. There were three originally, but only one that pertained to the Superstition Mountains.......of Arizona. In Glenn Magill's story, all three are related to the LDM.

In the accepted story line, Tex returns seven days after Ruth is packed into the mountains. That would be on the 20th. of June. "he rode in to check on the old man". No mention of Purnell and Keenan. According to the newspaper articles, they returned (earlier than agreed) to resupply Ruth and found his camp empty.

Small details that seem unimportant. Easy to find these changes to the story at this late date. Harder to determine an effort to muddy the waters.

You have made it more difficult for a good many people to sleep nights. The what if's keep running through your mind. :lol:

Take care,

Joe
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Post by zentull »

Joe,

I believe there was a lot to suspect in Purnell and Keenans story and they were never really cleared of possible shenanigans. From what I have seen, their involvement haunted them and left a permanent cloud of suspicion.

Tex and Jeff Adams probably spent more time searching for Ruth than anyone under pretty extreme conditions. Erwin Ruth is one of a number of eyewitness's to their own personal condition during the search. As soon as they had a lead, they were back out searching again.....no mention of so many others helping out.

I think the names missing from the searches are just as important.

There are too many eyewitnesses to Barkley trying to stall Ruth and afterwards the thoroughness in his searches, to put a lot of stock in his involvement.

Did he know or suspect someone? That is very possible.
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Moving Stories.....

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Wayne,

There is, of course, the story of Tex moving the body. 8O

Joe
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Post by zentull »

I believe Tex told that story without a doubt. I also believe the bodies he moved around were walking and a talking........
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The Search For Ruth Timeline

Post by novice »

The timeline of the search, for me, was an eyeopener. According to the papers, the search began about June 18, 1931. They indicate that the that search involved Pinal county authorities, along with Barkley and the locals. We know that Sheriff Laveen of Pinal met Erwin Ruth at the beginning of July and the search was not officially called off in deference to Erwin's arrival. It seems that Pinal felt they had done everything they could and their involvement seemed to stop shortly after Erwin arrived. I don't believe I saw any reference to any involvement by Maricopa county at all.

The newspapers stories seem to have become less frequent and Erwin was faced with waning interest. If there was one thing that Erwin understood, it was the importance of "publicity." On July 9 and 10th, Adolph jumped back into the headlines. It seems that Erwin had conviently found a letter in his father's dairy. (This whole episode bears further investigation I believe?) Another cornerstone of the accepted story that I'm no so sure about.

Then we have the whole airplane search orchestrated by Erwin that provided another boost to extending the search. The boy knew how to generate interest.

When did Maricopa authorities become involved? When did Jeff Adams become involved? Was Adams acting in an official capacity? I think the answers might prove interesting.

Garry
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Post by zentull »

I think part of the story that gets skewed is the 2 packers check on Ruth and ride to the Quarter Circle U and then Barkley(Probably pissed off that they took him in) goes and checks the camp and then alerted the authorities. Afterwards no one wanted to admit they wasted time initially.

The camp would have been in Pinal county.

Jeff adams and Tex were the 2 main trackers and search party guys for years. They knew the mountains better than anyone else. More importantly is they were not publicity hounds by any means. Ask someone who knew Gus Barkley and his public persona was as a quiet and reserved man. Notice all the photos someone is posing. In the one with Tex he is paused in motion before bagging Ruth's remains. He just happened to be there.
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Post by zentull »

"In the accepted story line, Tex returns seven days after Ruth is packed into the mountains. That would be on the 20th. of June. "he rode in to check on the old man". No mention of Purnell and Keenan. According to the newspaper articles, they returned (earlier than agreed) to resupply Ruth and found his camp empty"


No the story was after Tex came home and found they had packed Ruth in, he sent them in to check on him. They returned saying they couldn't find him at his camp. Tex probably went in after that pretty ticked off at how this could play out. It may well have been he was sent word and came in early and they were sent to get Ruth.


Jim Bark says the plate was found with the body I believe. His source would have been a close friend on the scene at the time.
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Story Line

Post by novice »

I'm not sure where the "accepted" story line came from. :)

I personally lean toward Erwin Ruth's account. He certainly wasn't sitting around after arriving July 1. He was in contact with those involved at the beginning of the hunt. Barkley , Keenan, Purnell, Laveen and Morse. I think he was asking a lot of questions and getting a pretty good feel for the lay of the land. I have been unable to find much in his account that doesn't check out. That he was over dramatic, egotistical, scheming, etc. I certainly won't argue that, but he gets a lot of things right.

I don't have Jeff Adams getting involved until July 15 almost a month after Ruth went missing. The hunt was stopped July 21. The newspapers identify Jeff as deputy sheriff but I also didn't find where he was acting under the direction of McFadden.

Erwin tells the story that it was Gertrude Barkley who talked Tex and Jeff Adams into making one final attempt. It sounds like they were free lancing like some of the other searchers.

Garry
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Map

Post by TC ASKEY »

Joe,

Your statement about the maps seem to add to the confusion.
As you said, Magill claimed all 3 maps pertain to the Superstitions.
The newspaper articles refer to the map, 2 maps and a large assortment of maps.

Did you ever find the original documentation and proof that you spoke of under the Bluff Spring thread on the other forum?
It may help resolve part of the statements from others.

Terry
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Confusion.....

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

I will assume you mean this:

"Another interesting fact, is the maps. There were three originally, but only one that pertained to the Superstition Mountains.......of Arizona. In Glenn Magill's story, all three are related to the LDM."

I believe two of the maps dealt with the Superstition Mountains in California, and only one with Arizona. If that's true, the Magill story was....padded.

Perhaps Gene Reynolds could add something to the subject.

Have a great Thanksgiving.

Take care,

Joe
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Unanswered Questions.....

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

I answer to your other question:

"Did you ever find the original documentation and proof that you spoke of under the Bluff Spring thread on the other forum?
It may help resolve part of the statements from others."

The answer is yes.

While it is not some earth shaking piece of evidence, it does create some questions about Glen Magill.

Getting ready for a big crowd right now, but I will post the information very soon.

Take care,

Joe
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Post by TC ASKEY »

Thanks. Would be interested in hearing it.
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Break Time.....

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

The importance of this information can only be realized by going back and rereading Glenn Magill's account of receiving the maps from Dr. Erwin Ruth. In the account, it sounds like Erwin had not seen the maps for 35 years. That is not true.

"Killer Mountains" was not the first publication to print Ruth's MAP. Magill received the map(s) on January 5, 1966, but in March of 1951, a story was published in Arizona Highways about a group who traveled into the Superstitions looking for the LDM.

Their map was a photo copy of the map carried by Adolph Ruth. It is a little different than what we get in the Cury Gentry book. I have the book that Curt presented to his mother, and it has a couple of corrections made, I assume, by Mr. Gentry. They are in the text an were likely typo's that didn't get caught prior to publication.

I will post two scans of the map in the "Old Maps" album in Member Archive.

Take care,

Joe
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Perfil Mapa

Post by buscar »

At Member Archive, you can view the Perfil Mapa on page 3 under buscar, ‘well-known’ as the Peralta-Ruth Map along with a photo. Also make sure you view the photo with the Quartz Vein In ‘The Hoyo’ (hole) Behind The Es Carbadia.

A happy Thanksgiving to all

buscar :)
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Maps

Post by TC ASKEY »

Joe,

Other than the directions on the map they are the same place.
Erwin Ruth may not have given all 3 maps to the individuals at the earlier
date that you mentioned.

In my opinion "all" 3 maps printed in The Killer Mountains do pertain to
the Superstitions in Arizona.

Terry
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Can't Disagree.....

Post by Joe Ribaudo »

Terry,

Don't disagree at all. The question is: Are all three maps really from Adolph Ruth?

Take care,

Joe
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Arizona Highways, March 1951

Post by novice »

Joe,

Can you expand on the contents of the Arizona Highway article? Who were the individuals, and I assume Erwin Ruth wasn't mentioned in the story? Any other details you can share that might be pertinent to our story?

Steve Creager sent me a copy of "A Don in Washington" by Gregory Davis. Fred Guiery states that the group met both Sims Ely and Erwin Ruth in Washington. This was in the spring of 1946. According to Guirey "He (Erwin Ruth) gave us copies of maps that his father had when he had come out here...."

Gregory quickly inquired, "You say copies of maps: now, I have only seen one map."

Guirey replied, "yes, you are right. He gave us a copy of the one map. There were other maps but we had only one that he gave us. I shouldn't have said "copies"."

The trip was to generate publicity for Arizona and Phoenix area so Guirey doesn't appear to be into the details of the treasure or maps at all. He only had a passing interest. The interview with Guirey was 1976.

I guess I not even certain which map it was that the Dons brought back?

Maybe the same one the individuals in Arizona Highways were using? I'm probably almost as bad off as Guirey when it comes to maps.

Anyway, any help will be appreciated.

Garry
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