Lost Dutchman Goldmine

Peter, Deering said his partner would be there in a couple of weeks. They had been in Arizona only a short time and had been in Prescot for less then a year. He worked in Danial Brown's saloon for a short time. We can assume one week or so. During that time the men became such good friends that Joe ...

LDM and Peter, Interesting posts. I don't believe the Apache ever had an organization called The Black Legion. I do believe they had and probably still have, an organization that we white eyes have labeled in a sensational manner. My original post was not written in a sensational manner. I gave only...

Peter, Nice to be talking to you again. We have strayed a bit from the Black Legion, but we are talking about a subject that I am partial to. Had Kayitah and Martine been shot by Geronimo, it would have been a more appropriate ending for him, then his eventual simple death. Both men were related to ...

Peter,
Do you put any trust in the Joe Deering story? Seems like a lot of inconsistency turns up in that particular legend. Makes me a little leery of the whole story.
Joe

Peter,
Welcome back. You have been missed. As you can see it's been very quiet lately. Your packing in sounds like me....twenty years ago. That pack and a hot bowl of chili would kill me now. You will have to tell us about your adventures.
Joe

Wiz,
I suppose you could compare the two. I think there is a difference, but it's not really important what you call it. The one major difference is that the perfil mapa shows a final location and is much more detailed. It is similar in the fact that if you follow it, you will find nothing.
Joe

Wiz,
It is not a map, but a drawing. It requires verbal directions or addtional drawings. I think he gave simple directions. Enter at.........you will see this picture. Go to the canyon below the saddle. Turn........or climb into the saddle.........follow the trail to my mine.
Joe

Wiz, If you read the postings on this subject, Nicoh was just as confused. I gave him the source in the third reply. I will give it again in case there is a problem. Page 87 of Helen Corbin's "The Curse of The Dutchman's Gold". LDM, Somehow I knew you would come thru with some kind of veri...

Wiz, I don't think implied works here. Seems like what I said was, " I took a picture of that saddle by accident a number of years ago while flying over the Supes. I didn't realize what I had untill much later, mainly because I had never seen the drawing." Since there are so many saddles w...

S.C., It really surprised me that LDM did not let us in on the source of this drawing, once you failed me. I have come to depend on you for reliable information. Thought for sure you would come up with this one. Makes me wonder if there is any validity to the drawing. The thing that makes me believe...

Today, for the first time in a long while, the sun once again sets on Jacob Waltz's gold. -K Aurum, Hard to believe that this nice little statement spawned such a lengthy discussion. Some interesting facts, totally new to me, have made for a very interesting topic. I said before that a lot of ink h...

Aurum, Eventually I will disclose everything I have discovered, including the location of the Dutchmans Saddle. As for Holmes, my opinion was offered as an explanation as to why he searched so persistently and sent his son out as well. If he stole the gold, it follows that he had to lie to explain h...

Ron, The place name problem you mention is a great point. It really takes us right back to the possible Waltz drawing. Enter the mountains from such and such a place, look for this picture and...............the mine will be there. All we need to do, is find the correct saddle with the Needle as show...

S.C., It would seem that all possible bases have been covered as to who was with Waltz when he died. Having said that, I would not be suprised to have someone else show up shortly. The persistence of the Holmes family is not unusual at all, even if they had no information from Waltz himself. We only...

S.C.,
I was a little suprised to see Rogers post. Glad you put in your opinion. I was afraid I was going to have to look into one more story. Nice to have guys like you doing so much leg work and sharing it with the masses. I do however agree with Rogers conclusion on the Holmes version.
Joe

S.C., WOW! Robert Allen. My friend you have a mind like a steel trap. I read his book just one time, many years ago and could not tell you one thing he wrote. I have never looked inside that book again. After all those years, the only thing I remember, was that I thought it was pure fiction. I just ...

Wiz, I agree with your assessment of the Apache. I suppose what got me going with Peter, was his absolute statements that there is no Black Legion, nor was there. Following that with "silly secret society", and "ludicrous". This was followed by,"to do so reveals ignorance of...

Wiz, Let me preface these comments by saying I have tremendous respect for Ron. His knowledge and accomplishments are well know by all of us. I would not however take Crooked Mt. as a reference book on the LDM. I think Ron would be the first to say he threw a wide loop on the legend. It might be tho...

Wiz, In 1851 the Apache penetrated Mexico to Mazatlan. They devestated it. Somehow the leader of that raid, gathered enough warriors who must have followed his orders for a long period of time, in order to accomplish that feat. That kind of campaign was not carried off by a bunch of unregulated warr...

Wiz and Aurum, The information you guys have is amazing. The time, effort and probable expense needed to gather the documents and evidence I have read in your numerous posts is impressive to think about. I don't think I could do it if I had another forty years. Since I am retired now, maybe......no....

Hi S.C.,
The only story I know of, has been repeated by most writers until now. Julia cared for Waltz to the moment he died. The rest, as far as I know is fiction, and I for one believe it to be just that.
Joe

Wiz, The story of Julia selling tickets to watch Waltz die is a new twist on a story that has been around for over one hundred years. Considering the research which has gone on over that period of time, I find it a little strange, that no one has even hinted at this story before now. I will take the...

Peter, Goyathlay does not belong on the same level as Mangas or Cochise. All were able and ferocious leaders, but Geronimo was not well thought of by most Apache. They were leaders who were revered to the point, that most would follow their orders. Geronimo had a limited following, but they made an ...

Knun, A new voice in the wilderness. You have taken a giant step out of the box on that post. Novel idea and entirely possible in my opinion. My opinion and five bucks will get you a cup of coffee At starbucks. Stepping out of that box is what will find the LDM, if it exists. My own guess on the Mas...

Roger, Very nice. A fresh approach. For me, if legitimate, the Waltz drawing from page 87 in Helen Corbin's first book. What could be better then a Dutchman drawing showing the area of his mine? I believe it's legit because of artifacts found just off the crest of the saddle, which are identical to ...